/flex In recent news, Tiy has said that he plans to look into guns. Here is where he mentions "Making common guns more common and legendary guns more rare" and "Increasing the differences between different guns". So, with that aside, what changes would you like to see for guns in Starbound? Some of my thoughts are here but here's a quick summary of my personal opinions: 1) Craftable guns. Even if they only have basic ammo types, it would be really nice to have readily-available ranged weapon options. 2) Ability to modify ammo. Some ammo is awesome (plasma = great torches), some ammo is...not awesome (triple split). 3) Knockback. Guns do low damage-per-hit, because they generally have faster fire rates than melee. Knockback resistance is calculated per hit, seeming to subtract a static number, so a 9.0 fire rate weapon has a rough knockback rate of 1.0 per bullet, subtracting any KB resistance eliminates knockback almost entirely. 4) Damage reduction for players versus enemy attacks. This seems to be a static damage reduction (hit for 100 - 70 armor = 30 damage taken). Just like Knockback in the above point, this punishes players for using fast-firing weapons. 5) Energy Usage versus Energy Pool. I don't think guns should be able to fire infinitely, with no pauses. However, I don't like that I can only kill 1-2 enemies with all 500 energy (Impervium helmet) before needing to switch to a melee weapon. I think that an ending point between the current status (one enemy killed for 100% energy) and "infinite ammo bullet hell" would be good. 6) Only being able to hit one enemy per bullet (discounting explosive ammo and plasma explosions). This is a very noticeable weakness in the current version of Sector X, where enemies are almost never alone. Generally they are in groups of 2-3. I can't "focus fire" on one target, generally resulting in 2-3 half-dead enemies that each do full damage. Not ideal! Other stuff. 7) I don't think guns need a short-range option that hits multiple enemies. That is exactly what melee weapons currently do, minus the energy cost. This would be really hard to balance, and I think gun changes should be focused on medium-long range situations, or skirmishing/kiting. 8) I don't think guns should do equal damage to melee, even with their limitations. This would introduce the playstyle of "Kill it before it shows up on screen" and that's not a lot of fun. No one likes one-hit-kills from long range, whether they come from birds or from your own guns.
Just a carry over here from the discussion in the general. I would love a Parasite Eve gun modding system, where you are given a gun workbench and can take elements and even visual characteristics I suppose of weapons found and combine them into highly personalized shootas. Hooray customization! How do you feel about the inclusion of some sort of power pack consumable that can extend your firing capability using your resources, something that these games thrive on, at the cost of a short reload animation and time cost? Personally I think that would be one of the easiest stopgaps to the issue.
I really did like PE's mod system (are you talking about the one on the PSP, or the PS1?), and I think it would be really neat to swap properties of guns you've found. This could be a good "resource sink" for both melee weapons and guns. I think it would be pretty funny to have a fiery bonehammer (no projectiles) or a tiny dagger with bubblesword projectiles (maybe it would be called Don Ho's dagger?). This would give players something to do with the excess weapons they find, but would also be a way to drain some of the resources from the game. If all weapons become sellable to vendors, but no extra ways to use pixels are added, this wouldn't be ideal. Pixels would be seen as meaningless, unless you want to print all 40,000 Smooth Metal blocks to build a new base. I'm not quite sold on methods to extend/increase energy regen or energy pools (or ammo, even). This means "Bread" which instantly replenishes 15 or so energy, but also could mean "Ammo Clips" or potential reloads. I don't think that a stopgap is something we need here, I think it's that guns need to really be designed or that their design/goal needs to be clarified. Most stopgaps are just temporary solutions, but I don't think we are close enough to the magical Release Date to take short-term solutions at long-term expense. To use Terraria as an example, when you crafted ammo, you either had way too many resources (and crafted 1000's of ammo out of boredom) or else you had not enough resources (and crafted 0 ammo because you were saving up for armor or a new anvil or drill). The difference between [Gun + cheapest ammo] and [Gun + best ammo] was too much, so it caused enemies to be balanced on the expectation that every gun user had the best ammo. This meant any gun user that did NOT have the best ammo "lost" and required a lot of extra shots per enemy. Again, Terraria, because I played that way too much. When players used magic, they either constantly ran out of mana (not enough stars!) or "mana" became pointless (mana flower + 100 mana potions). It was very hard to strike a balance between the two, because both were possible from a very early point if players were brand new or had already played through the game. If you assume that the player needs to land 3 hits to kill an enemy, but only has enough mana for 4 casts, then enemies can't be very quick or dodge-y. If you assume that the player needs to land 3 hits to kill an enemy but has infinite casts...you can have all sorts of fun monsters that dodge around and blink and stuff. Also, it really does depend on what role CF wants to have guns play. If they are intended to be a short-term burst of damage, then energy usage should be high and damage should be high, and no energy regen/replenishment should exist. Guns provide instant punch, and then you switch to melee for sustained fighting. If CF "Gun only" characters to be a viable playstyle, then energy usage should be low and damage should be average or slightly below average (compared to melee). They still provide a ranged advantage to melee and thus can't do the same amount of damage, but they can't run out of energy in a couple shots, especially against multiple or fast enemies. One of the worst feelings I had playing the game was when I had a shiny new gun (no comparable melee weapon yet) and I couldn't kill anything with it because I only had enough energy to fire once. Sorry for walls of text, but I think guns in Starbound are fascinating for game design theorycraft.
Honestly text walls are about the only way to have a complete thought on message boards. Think of them as little essays! These are both fine analyses of the differing systems and the gameplay options they provide. I think Starbound gets kind of a raw deal following an act like Terraria just because the one came first and the other has a similar style. They have a certain expectation that they are so easily compared to it makes it difficult to make something purely unique without disappointing people expecting something different. In the end however I really think this games design is favored by shooting for a punchy action style of gameplay rather than a more plodding methodical approach. They should keep that in mind whatever decisions they make with the nuts and bolts of the system. I mean the original Playstation game. Great game.
Yeah, it's definitely harder for Starbound because of the expectations. Terraria did something, and it was successful. So, a lot of people come into this (Starbound) with their expectations being based on what Terraria did. And, since "Terraria did it", there are expectations that Starbound either copies it or improves it on all fronts. I just like using Terraria as a starting point for design discussions because it had some, uh, not ideal situations. Gun + No/Basic Ammo < Melee < Gun + Best Ammo. Against bosses, you must assume players have infinite of the best ammo, plus a gun. Otherwise, you allow players with these things to easily stomp the boss. But, in doing so, you make all melee fighters require more time to fight the boss, which means taking more damage, trying to dodge more, etc. Not so good, right? I think Starbound looked at that, said "Ooh, that could be improved" and wanted a middle ground between [Gun + no ammo] and [Gun + best ammo]. That way, guns don't have as much variation in strength, and that allows them to be balanced easier. Lastly, but very importantly, I remember watching my older brother play Parasite Eve (1 and 2) on the PS1, but I don't do so well with horror games, heh. Or Third Person Shooters on consoles. I watched them and enjoyed it, but I'm more of a "Shooters require a mouse" guy, and I prefer Candyland to Zombieland. =P Oh, and the PSP Parasite Eve was neat, but was mostly "Play dress-up with some chick that also might be holding guns" with a side of shooter. Kinda neat gameplay, but wasn't very memorable.
