Upcoming combat changes

Discussion in 'Dev Blog' started by Tiy, Apr 1, 2014.

  1. Brassqund

    Brassqund Hard-To-Destroy Reptile

    That's look awesome!

    But... I got a question:
    I got a friend with a problem with one hand... he can't really using it for gaming so he use one hand with a controller
    (with a sofware for that... I am always surprise how much he is good). With the new combat thing, using that will be a problem or not?
     
  2. handsomeGenesis

    handsomeGenesis Space Hobo

    Woot woot !:party:Monsters can't fly around me like evil monkeys anymore :3 thanks devs !
     
  3. nours77

    nours77 Sandwich Man

    add big flying monsters, and make land monsters better will be cool but don t make by themself better fight, natural or not danger help too, trap (dart, big stone fall, tantacle vrangler, one liana grab your leg and stunt you, a carnivorous plant catches you and eat your lives, or not natural, neutral ia like npc turret, turret has lightning, laser, throwing net, antipersonnel land mines, with explosive, freezing, gelly...).
    Why all monster are only beast ? where are angry plants who can kill you and can t move but hard to see ?
    you should mix the level of monster, 2 level 1 with the mother level 2.
    you should give them more power for example him can divided, exploded, morphing, téléport, dig, get you a big knock back, turn your screen black few second, there is a lot of possibility...
    why they must pop by 2, they can come in pack of 5, 6 and you must run for you live and shit a liana for example, monster don t do all, when we add a lots of little danger if you don t see them, it will become a death sentence, hard and intersting not only most dps in little time on only monster and guard.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2014
    sleepy123 likes this.
  4. neokron

    neokron Yeah, You!

    Will you guys push this to unstable branch soon or will you gather more modifications before pushing this through?
     
  5. Gruntdonttoot

    Gruntdonttoot Subatomic Cosmonaut

    Will there also be experimentation with ammo on guns?
     
  6. ArcaneMusic

    ArcaneMusic Big Damn Hero

    But, but, sempai! The date! I don't know who to believe anymore!!!
     
  7. Ferrettomato

    Ferrettomato Scruffy Nerf-Herder

    Y'know, monsters in Starbound aren't actually hit-on-contact. They only damage you during certain actions, e.g. charging, body slamming, etc. I've passed by angry monsters in the past and come out unscathed.
    That's what we said about Free Realms. We're still not sure.
    Really, there already are big flying monsters. You know those glowy-red-sinister-looking-oh-no-about-to-maul-you-mini-boss-type monsters? Flying monsters can be those too.
     
  8. Draken09

    Draken09 Black Hole Surfer

    I think the post implied that the unstable updates are no longer going to be explicitly posted on the website. Am I correct in that understanding?
     
  9. neokron

    neokron Yeah, You!

    From what i understood would be often, but nothing related to not explicitly posting it
     
  10. Voyager

    Voyager Spaceman Spiff

    FINALLY! directional weapon swinging, I might actually want to play this game again when this comes out.
     
    Ferrettomato likes this.
  11. Nathaniel Moxley

    Nathaniel Moxley Title Not Found

    Oh thank god. Now I don't have to fight a thousand Flash Gordans on every planet :poke:
     
    Ferrettomato likes this.
  12. Audiophillie

    Audiophillie Scruffy Nerf-Herder

    thanks for the hard work as always devs~
     
  13. naufrago

    naufrago Void-Bound Voyager

    The changes you want to implement are all things that I've been hoping for, but there are a few issues that make combat really annoying for me- the creatures position on my screen doesn't always correlate with where the enemy's hitbox actually is. It's like there's lag between client and server, which is weird since I've only played single player (EDIT: I'm guessing that single player and multiplayer use a lot of the same code). The second issue is that there's a delay between when you switch to a tool or weapon and when you can use it. Seems to be based on the cooldown of the weapon/tool you're switching to.

    1) For the first problem, it's most noticeable when things are small and moving fast, like a flying creature. I'll fire a gun or bow, the projectile will make contact with the creature's sprite, the projectile will apparently disappear, but the creature may take no damage. When the creature doesn't take damage, the projectile still exists and will even hit creatures or terrain behind it, even though the projectile isn't visible anymore.

    My best guess is that the client and server can disagree about where the creature is (or the hitbox and creature sprite are tracked separately, which would be kinda weird). The issue is that it checks for a hit when the client says the attack connects, then it seems to compare where the weapon is hitting with where the server thinks the hitbox is, leading to cases where an attack looks like it hits only for the creature to take no damage. (EDIT: In other words, creatures and characters only take damage where the client's perceived hitbox overlaps with the server's perceived hitbox.)

    In the reverse case, a creature will look like it's not touching my character only to have it damage my character when I swat it away.

    2) For the second issue, the delay between switching to a weapon and being able to use it can be fatal. I can't have a slow melee weapon as my primary weapon because when I switch from a ranged weapon to a melee weapon, it's because what I'm shooting at is charging at me and I need to be able to whack it away immediately. I can't switch to a rocket launcher or similar weapon with a low firing speed in the middle of battle because by the time I can fire the weapon, the enemy is already biting my face. And when you get hit, it seems to reset the cooldown of your attacks again, leading to even more delay.

    EDIT: I'd recommend individually tracked cooldowns per weapon/tool, as well as a small global cooldown when switching between hotkey items, like 0.2 - 0.8 seconds (not delay switching, just delay activation). Short enough to not be much of an issue in normal play, but long enough that you can't just fill your hotbar with guns and swords and spam scroll wheel while holding left click. And if you get hit, it should activate the global cooldown, not the item's cooldown.


    ....I just remembered a few more problems I had with the combat system, but don't feel like editing the structure of my post, so... yeah.

    ---Guns are pretty dang weak (EDIT: and/or you run out of energy too quickly. Can kill one, maybe two, enemies per full energy bar, and the energy takes too long to refill). I find myself rarely using them.
    ---Some enemies can kill you with one or two hits. Not fun. Probably an issue with scaling, which you'll probably be taking a look at at some point.
    ---Enemies that use fast guns deal very little or even no damage at tier 10, while enemies that use slow guns can sometimes 2- or 3-shot you. NPCs with melee weapons are in a similar boat. Armor seems to reduce damage by a flat amount, which leads to annoying situations like that where there's such a huge disparity in incoming damage between enemies within the same tier. Maybe make armor reduce damage by a flat amount and a percentage amount.
    ---Wooden Spikes instantly killing you- not fun. I didn't even realize what had killed me the first time I died to one. I thought I had starved to death, which had never happened to me before. Turns out, no, that thing that looked like a background object is an insta-kill death trap even if you're in the best armor.
    ---There's a delay between when you take damage and when you get your invincibility frames. To illustrate why this is a problem- one time, I was jumping and a monster sprayed a cloud of frost right where I was about to land. I was in the best armor I could have at that tier (somewhere between tier 2 and tier 4) and I died instantly from full health. Taking one or two hits from a stream of projectiles isn't a huge deal, but creatures spray a ridiculous amount of projectiles and that damage stacks FAST. You really have to be on your toes to not die from anything with a ranged stream attack.
    ---Movement feels float-y. Sometimes I want to move ever so slightly to the left, less than one block, and I propel myself three blocks off the ledge and into the poison water or lava or pit full of monsters that I was trying to avoid. Kinda annoying.

    I very rarely die, but when I do it rarely feels fair. I've developed some pretty broken but effective tactics for dealing with combat, but it takes forever to do anything as a result. Since you're looking to make combat more fun, addressing those issues would go a long way for me.

    EDIT: Hope I didn't come off very harsh there. I tend to be a bit blunt. The rest of the game is pretty fun, it's mainly combat where I have the most issues and felt compelled to post about it.

    FINAL EDIT: just removed a comma and changed one of the words. nothing big. I should stop re-reading this post.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2014
    Yzzey, Akado, sleepy123 and 7 others like this.
  14. Sh0elace

    Sh0elace Phantasmal Quasar

    I did think the combat needed improving.
     
  15. Luchóg

    Luchóg Sandwich Man

    Sounds great! Not quite melee related but speaking of "making monsters heavier", I'm wondering if monsters will ever be reworked to take fall damage as the player does? If it's not in the works, it should be. Running away from mobs is difficult when they continually pursue you and you take fall damage while they do not.
     
  16. BunnyMan

    BunnyMan Subatomic Cosmonaut

    This is a great step to making a better starbound for all! I would like to say thank you for all your hard work!
     
  17. flamedance58

    flamedance58 Scruffy Nerf-Herder

    I didn't see much of a problem of how you wrote that out honestly.

    I think a bit of tough love is always good to see. If we all just nodded our heads and became Yes-men then this game would go nowhere.
     
    Yzzey, TheRoachMan and BlueSmoke like this.
  18. Hebephryo

    Hebephryo Phantasmal Quasar

    Unstable branch? Oh...


    These pink and white colours hurt my eyes. I still need them to stare at boobs.
     
  19. ControlTeamA

    ControlTeamA Big Damn Hero

    Finally! Fighting flying monsters with a spear was torture!
     
  20. Titanium

    Titanium Existential Complex

    [​IMG]

    I don't suppose this is what you have in mind for the future, Tiy?
     
    Yzzey, The Mogsta, killpay and 2 others like this.

Share This Page