So why do the floran hate the Hylotl?

My Hylotl would eat the hell outa a juicy ripe Florian.

 

And my Floran would glady make shashimi out of you, then throw you in the trash bin, and never look back.

Focus on he thread, would ya?

 

I feel like i remember reading some codex that some floran invaded and ate a whole hylotl city, hence the bad blood...

 

Herbivore would be a big reason to hate them. It also should be mentioned that fish dwell in the water, which they do pollute with their excrement and the natural chemicals they exude, while also devouring plant life nearby. The alteration of the water could have an effect on plant life growing around the bodies of water if they were sentient beings that could respond to changes in sustenance like animals do. That combined with the fact that virtually any race living with any extremely violent one would naturally end up being attacked, leading to more historical chances for rivalries to form. This is really obvious if you just look at humanities effect on, basically everything else on this planet.

Even though botany being made violent is a new take on the idea, it still is inaccurate. Plant life by design is passive and completely sociopathic towards everything else, save for their own species within their race. When a tree is attacked by insects it will chemically communicate with other nearby trees so that they can exude a chemical to ward off the insects from coming after them as well. But at the same time weeds will kill the flowers around them without caring at all.

Keeping true to their nature, the race should have been a tribal and solitary race, certain factions being more aggressive then others just as some plants are more volatile and ruthless in their growth then the rest. But as it is, very few plants are like that. Meh.

 

• Of course not, but starting a war of extermination over a few snide remarks speaks a lot more about the Florans than the Hylotl.
• some are, some aren't (opening Floran codex proves that) yet we've seen them attack human off world colonies before (full of civilians) so as much as they'd take special pride in fighting a worthy opponent, they're definitely not high and mighty when it comes the weak, they are a perfect example of Darwinism where only the strongest survive and you don't become the strongest by only fighting those you deem worthy.
• But we are superior. Anyway, the strong devour the weak (in the Florans case literally). The Florans as i previously stated have no sense of mercy for the weak. If they think you're weak the'd kill you.
• That depends strongly on you're perspective. They were largely a race of pacifists and so a violent tribal society such as the Florans would perceive them as weak however, we do know that they are/were masters of political intrigue (strongly hinted) and so probably wouldn't rely much on military action. There are plenty of nations now that are very influential yet have a small (in some cases no) military. It would also be ironic since that would protect them from more modern races such as the Apex/humans yet would screw them when it came to something like the Florans who really dont give a , on the other side i agree that the Florans are primitive due to their lack of education but they don't want it. There are examples where the the Glitch have tried to teach them yet they always ignore, refuse or attack the teacher, even the well educated Floran that wrote the book turned into a primitive stabist after being told his work sucked.
• well it was only a theory. Also that Avain log is completely redacted so i never implied they crashed with a small ship, i simply pointed out they're initial reactions to going leaving orbit. Also i agree that Florans went out to colonise the galaxy...its just that some of those planets may have been already occupied...
• Probably
• I'l coincide the fire point (it states somewhere that a stash of Hylotl weaponry was destroyed by a 'mysterious fire') but it also begs the question why? we know that Florans are afraid of saltwater and fire which were both present (the saltwater anyway) we also know the Hylotl had strong defensive technologies (the Tesla coils being their invention) and we know that both sides suffered massive casualties. So either the Florans are that stupid (they won the war Stalin style) or...-input reason here-...
• Then id suggest going fishing since this amphibians having salad tonight.

Not really,

• the human dungeon attacks you because you trespass on their military bases or enter a prison full of psychopaths
• Apex are doing questionable experiments that they would rather not go out
• Glitch dugeon is you pretty much breaking into their castle and stealing their stuff (they can see you eyeing their crossbows)
• Florans dungeon is a prison, similar to the human one except the guards are also Florans who don't take kindly to visitors
• Avians dont like you interupting their sacrifices or even want to sacrifice you.

None of these would apply to the Hylotl.

That's the Novakids, they're geniuses yet they have the attention span of a drug-addled goldfish. The Florans are clever (hunters need to be) but not over all that bright.

Humans never uplifted anyone. They have largely refused to interfere with other races and are probably the newest member of the intergalactic community (despite first inventing interstellar travel). The free Glitch definetly have motive to move forward considering they want to experience everything and escape the hive mind, The Hylotl are passive and content but not progressively stunted, especially since the war.

no argument there

The Florans took the Hylotl homeworld because Chucklefish

 

You know very well that a Hytlotl dungeon would have aggressive Hytlotl, likely fanatics of some kind. Secondly, Greenfinger shows just how intelligent the Floran are, and just about every Floran NPC essentially reveres what Greenfinger says. That Floran is smarter than many Apex scientists.

The Floran took the Hytlotl homeworld because of how dangerous the Florans are in combat. Oh, and the Novakids are more like Leonardo De Vinchi without the journals, they just find continuing on current projects to be well, boring and not worth their time.

 

• Also speaks of the Hylotls, to mock and despise a race that had more potential than them, and still has, just for the sake of mocking, instead of simply ignoring them, and maybe fortifying , just in case personal argues between races ocur.But no, had to mock the developing, couldn't leave em be, huh?
• A colony that's full of civilians, is also full of guards, which they fight with all their might.Do they also kill the weak?Yes, in the way Hylotls can also dedicate themselves to war, though most of the time, they are just eating, fucking, and hating florans.Just like Dilettante Eldar, but without Slaanesh.
• You arent.At all.
• You seem to be thinking in absolute extremes.Florans know mercy, just not in the hunt.Tribal doesn't mean inhuman.And canibalism isn't a ordinary thing for them, its mostly ceremonial, or imbued with spiritual meaning just like in real life.
• Whoa, teaching has been outlawed, its hard to teach a Floran, but Florans don't just kill Glitch teachers, and most of the time, are quite curious, and will atempt to learn.It was just outlawed, since the aforementioned Floran author being shamed, and as such, Greenfinger decided he didnt want Florans to do what he did.They enjoy learning, at least those who's attention spans last long enough, but they dont just kill Glitch.
• Its most likely a small ship, due to it being simple enough to replicate, yet small enough to be able to be shot down, or incapacitated by minor damage.Plus, a battleship, in the hands of somewhat more primal Florans, who had no idea, what the wazoo they were doing?Stuff would have been recorded immediately, too flashy to not be written.And I doubt those planets were already colonized, all the races arent that big to colonize all the planets in the universe, and the Florans, for what I know, were a tad distant from them all anyways.Plus,why would they go and make their colonizing more difficult, by starting wars, when they are so weak?Even a war like race knows when to holster the Choppas.
• Tesla Spikes were't their invention to begin with, just tech they used.And the fire, well, perhaps the Hylotls made that fire by themselves?Sneaky sea Snakes, like ya are, most likely were developing some weaponry, and feared we would get some of those sweet shootas and just end the war with them, huh?And your continuous usage of insults to the Florans is astounding, coming from a arrogant frog spawn like yerself, no wonder you provoked us so fiercely, we were able to destroy the entirety of your homeworld, with minimal resources, and kill everyone in there.Whilst beneath sea.With you having the defensive advantage.
• Figures, such a hippie, peacemaker can never trully experience the peace, and tranquility of the hunt.Bet you can barely even lift a dagger.

 

I've seen evidence of this, yeah. And actually, I don't find it hard to believe that a Floran could simply decide for him or herself to become civilized DESPITE their barbaric upbringing. They ARE sentient creatures just like humans, and are prone to being able to make their own decisions, even if those decisions go against the accepted norm.

This I'm not so sure about. I wouldn't say the Florans are being kept in a primitive state against their will, so much as their barbaric nature is working against them.

If you attack every stranger who comes to your village on-sight, it's not very likely you're going to learn much from them.

There are human tribes today that still exist in a primitive state because they are so violent towards outsiders.

Not convinced, and I'll tell you two good reasons why.

1. We have no idea how the overall populations of the Florans and the Hylotl compare. For all we know, there could be trilliions, millions more Hylotl in the universe than Florans, meaning even if the majority of Hylotl are pacifists and don't agree to combat, there are still plenty enough to fend off the Florans.

2. We only have a vague idea of the actual fighting strength of the Hylotl. Florans are hunters, meaning they've evolved to be most accustomed to fighting large, dumb beasts, several-to-one. Hylotl, however, are an advanced race with not-so-vague japanese influence and a number of references towards their historical might as a military, such as their ability to ride large fish into battle and having several different classes of warriors revered for their skill and prowess. The Impervium tier of their weaponry all have descriptions of how good they are at killing Florans. While many Hylotl may be opposed combat, it would be severely unwise to assume those that DO fight can't make up for the lack of numbers. If you speak to some of the Floran Villagers, some of them reference nightmarish recurring dreams of Hylotl warriors on their fish mounts wreaking absolute havoc, and otherwise hating the Hylotl because they are afraid. Yes, you heard me. The Floran do not simply HATE the Hylotl, they also FEAR them, as enemies in a balanced war OUGHT to. The only reason they're so brave and spiteful towards Hylotl players when they enter the village is because that player is alone. It's easy to be brave and cocky when you have your enemy outnumbered a whole village to one.

So, to sum it up...

- A majority of Hylotl being pacifists =/= Hylotl Fighters outnumbered by Floran Fighters.
- Hylotl are potentially more skilled in fighting multiple, humanoid enemies at once (they got that whole ninja/samurai/kung-fu shit going on, so who knows?), whereas Florans are tribal Hunters. It is the very nature of hunters to win fights by outnumbering the prey. Any situation where they can't do this, they most likely fail.
- Did I mention the Hylotl can ride f***ing WARBEASTS? And again, Florans kill warbeasts one at a f***ing time. Imagine how quick their jaws would drop when a goddamn ARMY of them showed up?
- The Florans have nightmares about them. This would not happen if the Florans were the "clear winners" as you'd like me to believe. You do not have nightmares about the guy who's face you stomped into the curb. End of story.
- The war's been going on for AGES. HUNDREDS of years. You cannot have an ongoing war for hundreds of years against a completely defenseless, outnumbered and unprepared civilization.

 

I'm honestly surprised at the very simplistic, savage view everyone has of a race that seems to have a lot of outside negative influence. Despots outlawed education. Sorry, but greenfinger, as smart as he is, is really bad news for everyone, especially florans. He and Big Ape keep florans from progressing culturally. Why? Not sure.

Florans are eager to learn! It is obvious when other races speak to them in villages and the like.

The prisons are ran by oaken soldiers converting prisoner florans with drysap into more oaken soldiers. They are not representative of florans at all. Greenfinger has undergone this treatment himself too, has he not? They are not rational creatures by any sense.

Have you spoken to florans? They're terrified of hylotls! Straight up terrified.

Actually, most florans are enamored with humans, it seems.

Then why are most florans really interested in humans? Especially the ones in the Outpost.

Florans are about as afraid of fire as any other living creature. Their homes are filled with it! They have huge oil and wood burning lamps!

No. Not very well educated. But reverse engineering stuff is obscenely difficult. Especially computers and the like. Yet they still did. And they have bioengineering.

For a race that lacks education, they are surprisingly intuitive.

 

I have a sort of fan-theory that Greenfinger, Big Ape, and Kluex may even be the same damn person.

How much of a mindf*** would THAT be!?

SOME Florans are eager to learn. Most are not. But, I agree with your point. We can't judge everyone by the actions of the few (even if the few is a lot).

THANK YOU.

I like that one Floran at the outpost. She was very polite to me.

Also, a fun fact. If a Hylotl player examines a certain item, I forget exactly what but it appears as some kind of handwriting practice, the Hylotl optimistically notes that this may mean good things for the future of Floran Society. Hylotl are not at all against the idea that Florans could one day be equals. They just aren't very sure it will happen anytime soon.

Humans are the rock-stars of the galaxy. Every race wants a piece of them. I personally don't understand it. My Captain is enough of humanity for me, thanks.

 

Oh sh-!

And they are the tentacles.

Armed society is a polite society after all.

[/quote]

Well, they did invent space travel and FTL....

 

OH WAIT. BIGGER THEORY.

Humans were the first to engage in large-scale spacefaring and colonizing, yeah?

Big Ape? Kluex? Greenfinger? A HUMAN DUDE.

 

Surely a fanatical Hylotl would just be an Extreme pacifist, also all the current dungeons are due to the dodgy governments of the races which the Hylotl seemingly don't have. They wouldn't have the prison camps o'r military bases as seen with the Human/Floran and the other dungeons are unique to that individual race (Avian sacrifices, Miniknog experiments). If there was one, it would either be something of an underground movement (of which there is no mention of..yet) or a bandit hide out which contains all the aces. Also the origins or even any general information about Grenfinger is limited, that's all we know is that hes over a century old (bare in mind that's a lot of time to work/learn) which is a surprise to all the races (except maybe the Novakids who just don't care) also there are no other Florans like him. Comparing the entire human race to Einstein and calling them geniuses is just wrong, especially since the gap between Greenfinger and literally very other Floran is massive and especially since Greenfinger is so...unfloran maybe?

I never said they weren't dangerous in combat but fighting an aquatic race in the best defended ocean planet that is literally poisonous to you and having to deal with tesla defenses? there's obviously a key piece of information that's missing and "were just that good" doesn't cut it.
Also that's true but it would have been a Novakid in the first place who created those journals and their massive fluctuations in tech is testimony to how quickly they can advance (and forget).

• The Hylotl definitely don't envy the Florans if that's what your suggesting, also its a popular theory that the Hylotl sent missionaries to them first and then they attacked so the Hylotl tried to teach them peace and they attacked as they thought they were weak (there's a thread somewhere with that exact debate).
• 1 word, zerg. attacked a human outpost that had both a military and civilian population (the lore goes out of its way to mention the civilian population) and since humans settled there it would have been full of tasty humans as well as probably a good place to start a new colony. obviously their not all that savage (although some, if not most of them are) but there certainly aren't warriors, they're hunters and since they have no/limited concept of non plant life everything is prey.
• It literally says they use politics and bureaucracy to bar opponents, also they seem to have a perfect society with no violence (apart from the odd Floran incursion), the other races know very little about what they actually do yet the people aren't complaining so its not the Apex regime, they have deep routed traditions (not the disturbing avian ones either) and stay well connected to the oriental theme yet little is known about their technological level other than they can create underwater cities, spaceships and tesla defences (which is pretty advanced), despite having no if any aggressive military they've had no enemy (surrounded by corrupt and potentially dangerous races) with the exception of the Floran. Its intriguing that the most intelligent known being (Greenfinger) started a war that killed millions if not billions of Hylotl and Florans for the purpose of weakening the Hylotl.
• They are tribal hunters who most of which don't understand the concept of non plant life, and yes i agree that doesn't mean inhuman and cannibalism is frowned upon by most Florans.
• It does say they attempted multiple times to stab the teacher (to no avail) however i admit they seem to getting a bit more open to the idea of education at least in the outposts (can you believe they let Florans in?!)
• I cant really say since this is all obviously hypothetical (including mine) but id imagine they would have needed multiple ships or at least on massive ship, perhaps it was a Hylotl ship that crashed in the first place or a missionary ship? after taking the ship, they would have had knowledge of good planets as well as Hylotl co-ordinates and id imagine that would annoy the Hylotl.
• You don't know that and they are the only race that has any thing to say anything other than variations of "i wouldn't want to touch that". That doesn't make any sense as i think its portrayed as a tuning point or at least a huge loss for the Hylotl. Insults? no we merely tried to help you realise your savage and clearly inferior ways in order to understand the benevolence and superiority of the Hylotl ways, join us, become one of us...one of us....one of us...
• Who needs petty daggers when you've got the might trunk cutter?

It does say somewhere that Florans have a deep rooted fear of fire (more so than other races) also their racial light source is actually a luminous plant, but beside that, i agree.

 

Typical hylotl. Thinks they're better than everyone.

 

Don't be offended. We're only making completely objective and factual observations.

 

ew... fisssh...

 

I don't think they initially hated them.

However Florans get easily upset and stab you if you counteract their rites. And eating raw meat is such a thing. Which is for the hyotls a big issue since they are totally herbivores. Probably the point where the missionaries of the Hyotls started to fail. also without eating meat, hyotls may not even go hunting. Which makes out a major part of the Floran society.
So the cultural rift is very huge between them. probably the biggest amongst all races. And then there was war between them ending in the Florans messeing up the homplanets ecosystem of the Hyotls. Which is iirc the point on where the games situations starts for the Hyotl player as one of those who fled form their homeplanet. Ontop, Florans like the taste of the hyotls, which also the avians do occosionally.

 

Holy hell, this is an 11 month old thread. That's some necromancy. At this rate we should have a Hytlotl hate thread stickied because it seems to keep cropping up every few months.

 

Don't try to butter me up!
I know your tricks I've seen them all!
You deceptive, primative monsters!

 

Well Greenfinger said he wanted to visit earth see the beast one day. So his diplomatic attemps between the races are probably to find the keys to open the door.
I also guess Florans have been a bit kept away from the education because their society and "ethics" have yet not evolved far enough to be granted so much power through knowledge, because they may use this for very bad things due to how their society currently works. Especially with their hate for hyotls that may turn out very bad for those. Single individuals are able to outstand, but the wide mass of a race often not.