white Demetrius and Maru. also a discusion on the mod.

Have I been replying in a hostile manner? I'm asking for real, I wasn't trying to be hostile at all. Representation affects people who feel under representing. I'm not about to write an essay, but I'll give you an example and then I think I'm gonna stop because the forum mod really just said everything that needed to be said, and also I was supposed to get other IRL things done like a half hour ago, haha. So, for me as a girl who grew up liking games and comics, while seeing very few good representations of women in those things I liked, I grew up feeling like it wasn't cool to be a woman and I disliked women. Obviously, that isn't all attributed to no representation, but it did have an affect. So, say I saw a game that was mostly or all dudes, and I wanted some more lady power, and I could mod it, I might think, wow, that would be a nice thing to see. And if it was mostly dudes, with a couple women, and someone wanted to take out the only two women I had, even if just for their own mod, I'd feel kind of bad about that. I don't know what gender or race or whatever you are, but maybe try imagining growing up without ever seeing anyone that looked like you? It might make you feel kind of different and other. Just something to think about.

I guess, personally, he can do whatever he wants, but it still feels not great, haha. Like, anyone can express whatever opinion or do whatever they want, that's fine, and then I can give my two cents also, and then we can all be on our way.

 

please do i'd download this in a heartbeat omg

 

okay...you made one post on this thread. i have no idea whose side you are on or what your reasons are...but i already like you. you made my day.

 

Got deleted, oh well. I have no opinion on the topic really anyway. Power to people for whatever they choose to do or believe. Godspeed lads.

 

Haha aww. I thought you came in at a perfect time. I just enjoy debates personally. Racial ones always have insane justifications.

Waiting for someone to break out the slavery card

 

if you want to see more of something...create it. don't change what someone else made to just make you happy. that will get you nowhere. plus many people HATE change. regardless of the impact.
i know that i requested a change...but...it was a counter to those who request change on things just to make them happy. well that was one of the reasons. i still have many more unstated ones.
EDIT messed up the quote for a second.

 

Or maybe it's because the game already has plenty of Caucasians but no Hispanics so that mod tries to add a little diversity without having to go through the hassle of adding a whole new character (if that's even possible), while this mod would be trying to get rid of the only 2 people of color. I wonder how poor Robin would feel seeing people disagree this badly with her life choices.

Replacing everyone with furries means no race is represented, and thus, there's no issue. The goal of this mod would be to remove representation of any actual human race other than Caucasian, which just demonstrates a "you're not wanted here" attitude, and THAT'S why people of those unrepresented groups would take issue to their one or two characters being removed. Humans are social animals. We want to feel wanted/represented. To expect otherwise is to show neither understanding nor empathy for other human beings. So to recap: Hispanic Alex exists because there's plenty of Caucasians and no Hispanics, and people take umbrage with the idea proposed here because it takes the only 2 people that aren't Caucasian and removes them, which makes even people who won't get the mod go "well, THESE guys don't want me here" and creates a negative atmosphere.

In the end, it's your game and you do whatever you want with it, but this thread just seems inflammatory. There's no need to "what if" request mods for other people, especially such race-bate-y ones. "Oh, but it's not about race" - given that the ONLY thing this mod would do would be get rid of the only varying human race, I find that incredibly hard to believe.

 

actually it is only about race because some people MAKE IT about race. in fact i dont even BELIEVE in races.
since race is the same as species... and there is only ONE species of human...there is only ONE race of human.

 

The biggest problem I have about this entire thread and the idea of an all white mod is the hatred it's getting. I could see if someone posted a blatant thread about blacks being disgusting and then added their all white mod below, but that's not what is happening. :/ I joined this modding forum because it seemed to be a safe and friendly place to try out modding and work on my pixel art skills. It upsets me that the members of the community are so willing to pick up a pitchfork over something this silly.

 

"It's not about race, but let me remove the only differing skin color". Whether you believe in race or not is irrelevant to the fact that discrimination based on skin color exists, and the fact that people want this mod to exist only shows that some people REALLY don't want that kind of diversity even in their games, which is what a lot of people here find troubling.

 

I don't really intend this to be negative, though I am against the mod and probably will be against mods of the kind in the future... I appreciate the fact that you are being polite and reasonable with the questions and issues you're raising. Many people I've seen around forums (not necessarily this forum but that's not to say it's exempt exactly) in the past tend to either resort to being rude or aggressive when it comes to matters such as these. I normally just lurk in forums so in advance I should say sorry for the lengthy post I'm about to dish out...

My reasoning behind not agreeing with mods that lighten skin is because I do see representation as being something important in media. More so for the fact because I see it as being fair for someone with a darker skin color to be able to find someone that looks like them in media if I, someone that's pale as snow itself, can find people who look like me in games/shows/movies. While some people of color or mixed race might not find a mod like this offensive, or think that representation matters (which is fine! they're entitled to their opinions just as we all are), that doesn't mean that they speak for their racial group as a whole... Some might find mods like this distressing and while it doesn't hurt someone physically, it can be distressing and hurt their self image. I'm aware that that isn't exactly physical harm but things like this do effect people. It might seem silly to others, but seeing someone like yourself in media is a really nice feeling! It could give you something to strive for or even just tell you that yes, it's okay that you look the way you do. Self worth isn't something that you can always control yourself. Society has a very bad way of putting people down just for how they look, even if they can't control it. And seeing someone that shares the traits you may have gotten negative attention for in a show or game or movie can really make you feel good about yourself. Might not be everyone's first concern, or really something that everyone worries about or pays attention to, but it is important to some people.

While television/movies/books might be a different story teller form when compared to video games it still stand that they are all a form of media... Representation in the former three isn't as hard to find anymore because there was such a push for equal representation in them. Take cartoons or shows in the 90's that always made it a point to have at least one black/asian/latino character in their castings as an example... Most media is still predominantly composed of white characters but the reverse isn't really true... Media that consists mainly of a minority race is normally kept separate, classified as something meant just for the race in it, or hailed as being a work of art regardless of the actual content but simply just because media with a minority majority isn't done often. Likewise, many games are composed predominantly of white characters and while that may not bother some people, it could bother others. It's a matter of opinion, social standing, the way an individual was raised, and their beliefs I guess.

On another note, I've seen some likening mods like these to aesthetic mods, but I don't think I would compare the two really... While I myself don't enjoy the mods that completely overhaul the portraits/sprites to make them a different style, that's mainly because I like to keep my games close to what the original creators had in mind... I guess that might be just because I also make games so my train of thought is I would like to stick to what they had in mind for their creation and if anything the mods I enjoy are the ones meant to improve upon what is presented in game. Example: giving Abigail's portrait a bow like in her overworld sprite or taking it away so that there's more consistency. That's probably just me though and I understand that people might see me as hypocritical for that or disagree and that's fine, assuming this thread is for discussion. What I'm trying to say though is that video games are a form of art as well as media and as such they are relevant to today's society/culture and are not free from scrutiny. Despite the fact that gaming communities are still rather small and closer knit than book or TV show cults, games still fall into the same general category.

I'm aware that mods like these won't stop existing just because some people have their feelings hurt or don't agree with them. The mod itself doesn't hurt me exactly since I am not someone of color or of mixed race, but it does upset me that mods to change skin color and race are still being made. Also I'm fully aware of the fact that people don't need me speaking up on behalf of their feelings or putting words into their mouths on the matter. People have different opinions and find different things acceptable, they are also free to speak up against or for things like this...

That being said, I don't agree with the mod nor will I download any if more are made, but that doesn't mean I'll be coming for blood or anything when they inevitably are lmao;; I have no control over what people do and honestly I don't see mods like these ceasing to exist anytime soon. This is a controversial topic though and as such anyone who makes these mods should be aware that people are going to call attention to and make a deal out of them. Some might be polite about their agreement/disagreement, others may not but either way mods of this nature are going to get mixed attention.
While I don't agree/support with these kinds of mods, I do regret that the original white skinned Maru modder got so much attention in such a short amount of time and I do hope that he's doing okay after the incident.

Apologies for the long post, I just have a lot to say on the matter and prefer to throw out my stance from the get go. Thank you to those that do take the time to read my post in it's entirety. :^)

 

So this thread has been a very entertaining read.

I for one would like to say I would support this mod being made available. Just as I would support a mod that changed everyone into green aliens, or purple bugs. Or black, hispanic, asian, whatever! Or all males. Or all females! Or robots!

The moderator made it clear it needs to fall within the guidelines and as long as it does there shouldn't be any problem. You don't want to see green aliens running around in your game? Don't download the mod! Hope to see it happen. Appreciate the thread OP, good luck.

 

so...its a problem if someone wants a fantasy world...that they like...but you dont like...
uh...how is it a problem if someone wants no diversity in a fictional place?
now if they tried to make that fantasy a reality by actually hurting people...then thats a problem. but if they leave it to fantasy and don't try to make it reality...then i believe its harmless and pointless to try to change.

 

I'll repeat what I said earlier:
While I will agree representation in society is important, especially for minorities the point is moot because minorities are represented in the original, vanilla game. Anyone who adds a mod that takes out the minorities is not doing them any injustice because only the modder will see an all white character selection. Please get off your high horse.

A mod of this nature will only affect the MODDER's game. The original game will still have representation of different races.

For example: a gay man plays this game and decides he wants to replace all the female characters with more male ones? Do i get butthurt and cry about my representation being encroached on ? No. I legit could care less, it affects my personal game experience 0%

I want to make everyone purple.

Do you care?
Didnt think so.

 

It's a problem that people push for such a mod to be made against the will of the majority. If the previous person who made the mod was harassed, then clearly the majority doesn't want that kind of sentiment here. The mod itself existing would do no harm, but seeing people go out of their way to specifically request it only creates an atmosphere where non-white people would not feel wanted or welcome. Thus, like I said earlier, this thread just seems inflammatory and unnecessary.

Refer to my previous post about making everyone furries.

 

FYI, this "colorblindness" you keep touting as a virtue is anything but. You're closing your eyes and willfully ignoring/dismissing issues that non-white people deal with on a daily basis, and calling them "silly" or "small" or "insignificant" (ie, being dismissive) just shows a level of disdain, ignorance, or apathy that hurts to read.

 

I fixed your quote for you.
I changed fewer than 30 words.

 

Will you marry me?

 

Godwin's Law so fast? Also, I wasn't aware defending democracy was now Nazism.

 

godwins law only applies if used as an insult. it does not apply if used to show flaws in an argument.