When should I start asking "Are we there, yet?"

Questions came up in another thread, but it got locked up before the questions got answered or debated. Figured that a new thread was warranted. This is not meant to be troll bait, continue old battles, or gripe about unrelated topics. I understand that some of these questions may not have one answer, and some may only be answered in time.

• How long is it reasonable to wait for this game company to produce significant (and promised) changes to this unfinished game?

• When will we see significant changes and fixes (as apposed to minor tweaks, additions, hats, etc... that seem to come up somewhat regularly) to this game?

• What (if anything) can we game owners do, IF in another 3-5 months, there have been only minor game changes & additions?

Not really part of the topic or part of the debate, but felt you might want to know where I'm coming from in regards to the questions... (Edit- I put this in a spoiler tab, thanks to Pentarctagon)

I love the idea/concept of participating in a beta game, (alpha, whatever) and prefer to literally "put my money where my mouth is" in support of good ideas. I'm partially curious if my investment (30$, so far) was wise this early in the game. I'm also aware that some ideas and concepts may only sound good or may be good, but poorly implemented.

Haven't played in 9 days as of this posting. Have not given up on this game, just taking a break.

Purchased & played starbound. (312 hrs logged , probably really played 1/2 that) Made it to sector X, tier 10 equipment. Love the game, (not blindly) but want more and better content. Purchased a second copy for a nephew, but only because I promised him it (he only played 20 hrs). Only added one mod (bout' 2/3 rds the way through) , Fully Customizable Ships, cause' I like building ships & personally think a sandbox space game should have a sandbox space ship. Without adding FCS, I may have taken a break in playing earlier. The last 10 hrs of play included about a 1/2 dozen mods & some modding work. Will not be purchasing additional copy's of this game 'till the game is far more finished, and then only if I like this product.

Purchased & played project zomboid (29 hrs played)... very, very, very disappointed with it. May come back to it in a couple months. (That's 3 very's! 4 would indicate madness)

Purchased & played Terraria. (472 hrs logged, played bout half that, too) Purchased an additional 6-7 copies for friends and family. Like the game, almost love it. Still play it on occasion.

I like hats and other vanity items in games... thought that was important to add.

 

To add: This game has been worked on now over three years? I've lost track of exactly how many. Also, they do seem to be hiring more help.. well at least one more person seemingly... but also hiring another full team to work on another game. While this may not /directly/ slow Starbound development it will certainly have some effects on it. Pretending Starbound development exists in a vacuum would be silly. Resources and time will go into that regardless.

I fear little can be done to respond to the opening, other then hope the developers invest more time into the underlying work needed to get their AMA game plan in place. I have concerns it is being spent on things such as office space, and other tasks. Small things by themselves, but again it is the small distractions that add up over time which extend a project like this. They also seem to be relying heavily on mod content, to help provide some buffer.

As for reasonable, that depends. I can easily see the game remaining in this state for a year or so before achieving the next stage of the beta progression plan Tiy posted. That is only a vague guess based on a year and a few months "progress" I've kept track of however when compared to their stated end release goals. Is that reasonable given the amount of preorders, and in turn support they have received? By a legal accounting sure.. as far as I know they don't even have a contract with Sony over Ps4/Vita releases other then when its done. However in other respects it does seem odd they seem to have hit a large speed bump.

That said, some players may be responsible for that, but that doesn't completely absolve Chucklefish. It is just worth noting they have done many projects seemingly focused on improving the quality of life for beta testers vs implementing primary mechanics because those players where focusing on character wipes so much. Which is understandable and I don't knock them for taking the time to.. but am concerned it has possibly contributed.

Where that leaves things, is hard to say. I have no doubt change is in the pipeline, realistically 3-5 months the game very well may appear in about as unstable a state it is now. I believe they could make choices that would speed things up.. but those choices would cut into their other plans. It would be nice if Chucklefish would assume Starbound as worthy of complete focus until full release but it seems that just isn't going to happen. So we'll have to see what does.

Just my 2c on it all.

 

1. 3 months is fair enough, by my view. perhaps up to 6 if it is demonstrated that major changes have been in the works (i'm talking videos, not screenshots)

2. because they were so horribly wrong about their first release date, then beta date (shipping us this shadow of an alpha for pre-release) company policy is to not give dates on ANYTHING. once bitten, twice shy, i guess. so, the answer to this one is "anyone who knows is not allowed to tell you"

3. depends. i need to review the terms of steam's early access policy. did starbound have a kickstarter? also need to see what jurisdiction CF falls under for truth in advertizing laws. honestly, if the situation were to come up, the realistic thing to expect is no legal/monitary action, and everyone at CF suffering bad press and stigma akin to john romero.

 

Just a fyi heads up Swatelite and D16. You may know this and if so - ignore my post.

Starbound had a pre-order. Not a kickstarter.
The two sometimes get mixed up because they offered bonus goals depending on how much they made to be added into the main game. One of which being the Novakids.. like a kickstarter would, but with very different terms laid out. Chucklefish wrote their own sort of faq for the whole deal at the time, which they later revised due to changes.

 

not to me it hasent. kickstarter means kickstarter.

you're doing the equivalent of calling all game consoles a "nintendo" by calling all crowd-funding "kickstarter".

so, to continue the analogy, you tell me you have a nintendo, so when i bring my carts over, i am amazed and distraught to find you have a master system, not a NES.

 

that explains a great deal. you obviously were not around during the 80's.

PC was never a brand.

cola was around before coke and pepsi. it refers to a flavor. "coke" or "pepsi" would be the correct term.

see, we're looking at brands, trademarks, that have become part of general language. asprin would have been a good example, as well as heroin (bet you didnt know that heroin was a brand name?)

this mainly comes from companies not protecting trademarks. in google's case, it was intentional.

do not use "popularity" as an excuse for general ignorance. just because everyone else is being stupid is no excuse for me to be stupid. and it is stupid to use a word that means a specific thing intending to mean a general thing.

 

Interesting and informative.

So, back on topic, it looks like significant game play change is at least months out, and a near final product may be years away. This would be a realistic assumption to make, yes?

Hmmm... glad I'm patience, and like hats.

 

aside from lolwiki, you didnt even read the first paragraph, did you?

*ahem*

for the record, i was born in '81.

cola comes from kola wine, so named because of the use of kola nuts. coke wasent even the first cola from the guy who invented it.

no, that is not neologism. it is a brand name slipping into the vernacular because of poorly protected trademarks, and the general ignorance of people.

edit, this was written up and posted as jonsey was admonishing us. i'll stop.

dont call it a kickstarter if it wasent on the kickstarter webpage, kthnx

 

Again with the hats.

Investments made are usually based on facts and performance history (something CF is distinctly lacking), not promises made by the company itself. Investments are always made on belief and more than a little faith, which really is just another form of patience.

Look at it this way: If you've gotten 150 hours out of your lousy 15 buck investment, you've gotten a return of 10 cents/gaming hour. That's what, equivalent to 600 hours in a AAA title? I don't consider that bad at all and money already well spent. You've recouped your initial outlay (and then some) and now you've just got to sit back and have faith that the dividends start rolling in as promised.

 

i'm not following your math here, could you please explain?

 

I think the math is a fair assessment, and pretty sure I've only gotten close to a similar value ratio on some more expensive AAA big brand name games.

 

Correct answer is never unless you want to be known as obnoxious

 

I think you're getting lost in semantics. The point is that @Zurgh has played 312 hrs of this game. He's already gotten great value out of his purchase, provided that he wasn't being tortured while he was playing it.

Also, we preordered the game with access to early beta. The prospect of playing early probably got them a bulk of their sales, but is that Chucklefish's fault? Or is it the consumer. I know what an unfinished game is, beta or alpha. I am playing what I expected to play.

What did everyone else expect when they purchased their preorder?

 

There's just no point in asking when atm.
It's like asking "are we there yet", when the car/train/bus isn't even moving.
What content did we get in the months since "open beta" that helped improve the game? what core features were added they didn't want to replace anyway?
We did get some weather content that could be considered as such, but that was very little content that shouldn't have taken more then a few days.

We do know parts of what's going wrong at chucklefish, but there's plenty we don't know.
Some additional info would be nice, especially considering we did fund the game for them.

But as it is currently, it's just not going to happen.
Best thing you can do is walk away or ask for a refund.



Regarding to the value thing,
Would you have purchased Starbound if instead of their current pitch they'd tell you of what the game was exactly like. would you have bought it? i wouldn't have.
I expected something more, and frankly i still do. Not 100% of what they promised ofc, but this feels like a empty shell of what it could have been.
I don't really regret spending the few euro's on this either, i think it was a fair gamble and the odds seemed good. But nonetheless still quite dissapointed.