What do you think about the Tier System ? (The Sandbox is no Sandbox)

Hehe, I think it's probably just my inability to write...

The tiers in the same sector bit is really badly written - sorry. What I mean is why can't we have a universe where all the planets of all levels/sectors are present but where the balance is such that you really can't set foot on a beta level planet without end tier 1 gear (all this tier/level/sector stuff is confusing, but I hope you get what I'm saying!) without being annihilated. That way, you can get a glimpse of things to come without this 'gate' blocking you.

I think the difference can be shown in the two items that you mentioned. The molten core is great because it allows you to build something that you previously couldn't but knew about. When I opened the crafting table window the first time and saw the metalwork station I thought "ooh, I wonder where you get a molten core from - it'll be fun to find out!". When I killed the first boss and got it, there was a logical progression to the next stage and I had access to more content. With the processor, it feels more like a maguffin for unlocking stuff. Might just be me but that's how it felt.

Also, If we had a range of different difficulty tiers in one universe, it might well encourage us to set up transport to and from previous planets/bases etc. rather than just having us discard all we did previously because we "levelled up" to a new sector.

 

I think you should just wait for Stage 2 Beta :

Stage 2 will be largely feature complete. You’ll still find the odd bug but they’re unlikely to be game breaking and the chance of you losing your character or save is minimal. The main quest line won’t be in yet but the sandbox experience will be near complete. All sectors of the galaxy will be available including sector X (End game content). Much of the focus in this stage will be on bug fixing, optimization and balance.

DO take part in this stage if:

• You enjoy reporting bugs/bughunting
• You have a low spec computer and want to make sure the game is optimized for it
• You want a complete sandbox experience
• You tried to wait a bit longer but failed

 

It shine quite bright with Industrial mods like Tekkit, or mods mixing of exploration and building. The only thing they need to give you - a reason to build something (like factory, nuclear reactor or some magic stuff). Building something just for a looks isn't so interesting for many ppl.

 

I beleive he wants everything in one sector instead of multiple like we have right now with Alpha, Beta, Gamma, X, and so on.

 

It's really not that difficult. Progression by exploration, crafting and building instead progression by hitting some giant with a stick for half an hour after I caught him under adirt wall and then forget about the sector I just explored.

 

My thoughts exactly. And i'm writing right now because i want a complete sandbox experience with a storyline in release. I don't want to play just sandbox part without story and quests. And i don't want my sandbox chained down to boss fight and story either. I want both story and sandbox part working together to create a full game experience. And i know it's possible.

 

I took a look at the pixels & ore required for each item that summons the boss of each tier.
Alpha - Easy
Beta - Much more time consuming for mining and Pixels. Kinda Shocking.
Gamma - Cost more money, but requires much less ore. This will only depend on the frequency of this ore.
Delta - Should be easy, the hard part of the game is over now.

I kinda like the fact that the game is more demanding in the middle stages. Thus as you progress through the different sectors, it does become easier.
I made a quick little chart in excel.

 

So I read the first bunch of posts. What I got is that the op doesn't like the bosses. To be honest, if you don't have a problem wirh material collection then why have a problem with thw bosses? The material collection is the grind and wall, not the bosses. By the time you've collected material for things like armor and buildings you have more than enough for summoning the bosses. I think they have the perfectbalance because ppl who like the tiers have the bosses and for those who don't its not a big deal. I tore up the first planet i was on and got a ton of materials. I had enough for armor and bosses to get to tier 3. all I needed extra was a better weapon for the second boss.

 

The bosses are easy and take all of 5 minutes to kill, as opposed to possibly hours to amass all the materials you need for said boss. You're complaining about bosses being gateways and that limits your sandbox capabilities, but then the same argument could be applied to tools. You can't hop skip jump straight to diamond drill now can you? That's because you need to progress to it. Are you trying to tell me you should have everything possible available to you within 20 minutes of gametime? Cause not even Minecraft does that.

 

Why not just put everything on your ship? You can even farm on your ship.

 

I don't think its the tier system it self that's the problem. Every game has some sort of artificial progression and limits the player from going to the end of the game at the start. Also every game has 'grinding' in it, but some games just mask the grinding better. I think its the presentation of the tier system thats the problem right now. By forcing the player to progress in a certain way the progression feels linear, when instead it should feel natural. Instead of the boss unlocking the next tier, the boss should allow you to survive the next tier. Meaning that from the start of the game you should be able to go to the next tier but be horribly mangled by something...maybe lets you sneak in and grab a item if your skilled.
Of a change like this to the tier system wouldn't be that much differnt than what is in place right now, but the presentation would be. The player wouldn't feel like the world is a closed thing that is slowly unlocked. All my opinion of course.

 

Neither do I. Better tools, new building materials, that all can be an accomplishment. And yeah, of course you to work for that, and of course you always try to become better. But right now, on every playthrough I work for the same tools and the same armor and the same weapons to kill the same bosses, because it's the only strategy to progress. I can't trade, I can't charm npcs into doing the work for me, I can't play the intergalactical stock market or become a mercenary. All I can do is slay penguins, a robot, and than a dragon, and everything in between becomes meaningless until I do and even more after I've done so.

I really don't get why so many people in this forum aren't already fed up with doing that over and over again and even get into crusader mode because they fear for the difficulty and such. I guess they are already bored out of their mind, always was wondering where that expression came from...

 

when I land on a planet i tend to stay a while and RARELY go to the ship unless i die or it's time to leave

 

i hate flailing around the "it's a beta" argument , but sadly it's just that ... it\s the bare bones mechanics at the moment and slowly building up to the game we all aspire it to be

 

You couldn't do any of that if the bosses didn't exist either... They aren't in the current form of the game.

I'm not seeing how "I work for the same tools and the same armor and the same weapons" would change if you had access to all tiers of weapons... then you'd choose the best and use the best tools and the best armor and the best weapons.

What other strategy to progress would work better? Don't just say "that doesn't work", say why and how you would do it. All I'm seeing in this post is "I can't find a way to make the game fun for how I want to play, therefore the game is dull and boring."

 

I don't hate the current system, but it can sorta get bland the higher you go, as there needs to be something new each tier, as well as look generally more futuristic (a few of the later tiers look less sci-fi future and more fantasy, and the progression of when it starts feeling futuristic is a bit too late)
Guns need to be craftable to an extent at later tiers (say being able to craft a specific type of gun, but not be in control of the stats) because even if I'm using a futuristic melee weapon, in the end it still feels like a melee weapon.

The main problem I have with the gating system as it is now is that all the bosses ONLY drop the gate item. They feel like a gate when that happens. Look at WoF from terraria, Eater of Worlds(not that he drops the gate item, but the gate item craftable lets you craft armor and weapons) plantera, etc. They all work well as gates because they don't feel like they're ONLY a gate.

Oh, and bosses are really bland as it stands. Only the UFO and Dragonfire are really interesting (and thats mostly because for the most part you don't have a good way of hitting them)

 

I get this right now. Minecraft allows you to build diamond armor should you find it and have the correct tools, however, you still need to get the correct tools to even get to that point. That in itself is a leveling system. Sure, it creates some instances were some jerkoff spawns right next to a conveniant pocket of diamond and iron, but it's not like that's going to consistently happen. And even then, so what? The vast majority of people are going to be playing a fair game. I think the bosses are a fine idea but they shouldn't be required completely for progression. And I agree on the Skyrim/Fallout points as well, it's ok to have a self-contained storyline thats the "main" but I imagine plenty of people want to travel to join faction-esque things.

People would like a more open sandbox without such a level system, and I dunno, I think that's pretty alright. You'd still have to grind up for the materials but its not like that wasn't part of the game anyway. And for the people saying 'Why not just a complete sandbox mode?', that's assuming people don't want to play through some sort of storyline, they just don't want to be tied down by what we have currently.

 

I agree. it feels wrong to use a stone pick axe to hack through a steel base!!

Ive been saying this for a while. Every planet needs to contain ALL tiers of content. There should be a natural progression, with space travel used as a way to get unique gear or find more abundant resources or just for exploring.

 

Ok, let me help you read my post.

I can do it in capital letters, if it helps, I could also repeat my other posts in this thread, or what about my own thread about building in the game?

 

Snarky for sure...

Ok, how would you sent up trade? Would there be a glactic market or local? Would you be able to issue orders to NPCs or have them be autonomous? What does becoming a mercenary entail? What would you trade on the stock market? How would it be regulated? Would it use server data across all online players or be random within your universe? Do you want to be able to trade for pixels? Or do you want to be able to swap hard goods? Are these NPCs ones you come across in the universe, or are they the ones you can create? Would you have to pay them to work? Would they require tools or equipment? How would you deal with them on different planets or sectors?

Smart ass.

edit*

To address your point of using those for progression:

What would a milestone for intergalactic trading look like? pixel count, hard goods, ores?
What does a mercenary do to progress?
How does charming NPCs help you to progess? The more people you have?
Do the number of trades you make help you progress?