Stopping players from walling monsters in

I really dislike the idea of mobs breaking ANY blocks. I really don't want my hard wqork to be torn down by a few mobs :/ I like to build big buildings with lots of rooms and a giant storage room for all my crap and really don't want the stuff destroyed because of a boss or mob :/

 

A couple of reasons why I believe giving creatures terrain destruction is an awful idea.

1. Aesthetic - Unless they create a way for the game to recognize player placed blocks, creatures will be tearing up terrain which ruins the look and feel of a planet and over time can erode areas completely away.

2. Despawn time - the ridiculously short despawn time will have blocks disappearing before someone can get to them.

It's an objective fact that giving creatures terrain destruction is a terrible idea. Wait. No it's not. How silly of me to try to present what is neither objective or anything other than an as opinion as such. What was I thinking?

So, that's my opinion. Thoughts?

 

Do what they do in tower defense maps on RTS games - if there is no conceivable path to the player, the monsters attack the blocks. If there is a conceivable path, try to use it. Possibly have grades inbetween like "this is too hard, easier to knock down the wall".

Another idea: when you're in combat, music changes - this means there's a "combat" state and a "peace" state. How about being unable to place blocks when in the combat state? Simple, effective.

 

But it's not an opinion that it breaks tge game, it's a fact! You are invulnerable from monsters, and you can still kill them easily. It's an exploit that needs fixing. Imagine an FPS where there was a spot on the map where you could see everyone, but nobody shoot at you? It's game breaking. No doubt about it, people keep whining that it's a sandbox. So what? Sandbox doesn't mean easy mode. Ssndbox isn't cheats, its a mode that simply gives the player the decsion to make their own story and world. Not the ability to exploit the game because you can make your own decsions. Next you'll tell me save file editing in OP armour is fine because it is a Sandbox?

 

What Does or doesn't break a game, even if everybody agrees with you, is still an opinion. It's subjective and therefore not a fact.

 

I think this is a great idea, here's how I think it could work:

1. Regeneration: Blocks already have HP (Hit points), and they already have HP regeneration. Tweak the regen so, that blocks regenerate slower when low on HP, and faster when high, with the peak at almost full. Imagine a ball being released from a 10 story building, at first it barely moves, but as it gets closer to the ground its speed increases - exactly that.

2. Placement: When blocks are placed, they are placed with little to no HP, and they slowly start to regenerate, this process should be quite fast, no more than a couple of seconds, but enough to be noticeable. Once the time's up, the blocks are full HP and are there to stay. (Only player placed blocks are affected by Placement)

3. Damage: Various monsters have various damage rates to blocks. Regular monsters will have very low damage, night monsters will have low damage, minibosses with moderate damage and bosses with high damage. Because blocks that have just been placed have low HP they also have low regen, and so monsters don't need as much damage to take them down as they would with full HP blocks, this means that if you place a block and a second later a regular monsters comes up, he might be able to break it down, but if you placed the block 5 seconds ago, that regular monster just can't cut it. A boss however might, because he has more damage.

These are the 3 principles that I think could make this work, so what does this accomplish really? Well let's see:

1. No more instant invulnerability, recently placed blocks can be torn down.
2. More strategy is required when approaching dangerous situations, you can't just run around with a full stack of dirt and expect to do whatever you want.
3. If you build a house and a few minutes later a hoard of monsters comes up, your house won't be affected, because the blocks are full.
4. Bosses are an exception, and should be able to break most blocks. Come on guys, you have to agree with this one, there's a reason people say "Like a BOSS".
5. Generated terrain will mostly remain unharmed, because those blocks are full from the start. (Bosses are an exception)
6. Most of the systems are already there, just needs a bit of tweaking. (Mainly with pickaxes' effects on the blocks)
7. Different blocks could have different HP/regen values, meaning you'd have to choose your material carefully when building houses and the likes.

I'm really tired so I'm sorry if my description was a bit hazy, but I think something like this could maybe work for both sides.
Let me know what you guys think.

And yes, I did make a user just to write this

 

It doesn't take a hardcore gamer to notice how dangerous it is to have mobs that can alter/destroy the landscape. Look at Minecraft for instance. Over time, endermen can very easily erode the land because they can pick up blocks, concentration of creepers and tendency of fighting them near your base is going to result in craters deforming the landscape. If you want a more extreme example, spawn an end dragon in the overworld or a large number of ghasts.

 

Completely negating a game challenge that is intended to serve as a gate to player progression is not really an opinion.

 

But it wasn't supposed to be in the game in the first place. If it was, the devs would have catered to this easy mode gameplay. It makes all other tactics null and void if you just trap every monster you see and the game loses meaning.

 

I think pathing issues could cause a problem but to riff on your idea, if a creature can't path to you, it could run away and keep it's distance. Ranged weapons are blocked by walls. It's only melee we're talking about. It's not an issue if creatures stay out of range of your blade.

 

And if I disagree with you, how do you prove your point? You don't have an empirical standard making your assertion an opinion.

 

You have a point, there is no "standard" of what combat should and shouldn't be. But it should be common sense! It trivialises one of the core aspects of the game. And it bothers me to see people defend a flaw in a mechanic that nullifies the overarching mechanics of difficulty and exploration. The difficulty is whay keeps the player moving foward, to evolve their playstyle, and adapt to new scenarios and technologies. And if players just trap any monster that is slightly difficult to gain better weapons, then it ruins the exploratory aspect. Same goes with people who hop from co-ordinate to co-ordinate because they know where the best and easiest items are.

 

I love the idea of some critters and aggroed NPCs affecting blocks. I know most builders gasp at the thought. For me it makes the game that more unpredictable, dynamic, and alive. There are a number of ways that this could be limited so builders don't freak out.

1. Only some planets are flagged for this behavior.
2. It could be limited by planet threat level.
3. The player could have beacons they place that protect blocks. The beacon would have a start up time and require wired power. Placing the beacon in a friendly town would be considered an aggressive action.

 

I'm inclined to agree with you. I do think that something needs be done to offset the ability. I hesitate to say the method Terraria uses is the best method because it makes it hard to hit things on sloping terrain.

But I really was only taking issue with presenting opinions as facts as some have in the thread.

 

Why I would want what? Nowhere in my post did I say anything I wanted, I only said a couple things that I didn't want.

Obviously they should balance the combat (and probably will unless their dev team is braindead) so we don't get one-shotted with god-tier armor, but this thread was about walling monsters in, so I was responding to OP. The underlying issue is obviously combat balance, but even once it's balanced out, I still want to be able to fast-wall, and wall-in monsters etc. I'm not opposed to some monsters being able to gradually break through walls, some monster claws might behave like pickaxes, but too drastic a change in a different direction could equally mess it up.

 

Still standing by the ideas that enemies should not be able to destroy blocks, there are other ways that have been mentioned that doesn't cause problems for more creative people. I'm almost certain people play this to build/various other things besides adventuring and what have you, and having monsters destroy their mega builds would not be cool at all.

 

a block cool down after bieing hit might be a good sulution

 

There are plenty of similar exploit mechanics in Minecraft and other games. You can easily funnel mobs into traps where you can attack them freely through small holes, etc. Or outright kill them without raising a finger!

You ARE arguing against the norm. Without good reasons. This stuff is extremely common to this type of game. And always has been. It's a large part of the charm of a sandbox game, to create your OWN mechanics to solve problems.

People have already given many good reasons why the ideas to fix it are bad for the game. And it's ultimately only a legitimate balance concern if you have some kind of open, official servers with legitimate competitive PVP play. Which there will not be. People will be playing private groups on private servers, where they can agree on mechanics to stick with. Where they can set rules and kick people out who do not comply to their ideals.

There is simply no justifiable reason for such changes. They break the game more than help.

This doesn't actually affect balance. The constantly crying of unfair PVP is completely overblown. This isn't League of Legends or something.

And it also is not a good enough reason to change something just because some people lack the self-control to avoid using it. Which is what a LOT of this really is about.

I sincerely hope the devs ignore you guys on this. You need to stop worrying about how someone else chooses to play. It simply does not affect you. If you PVP with someone who does it, pick other people to PVP with. Make the rules clear. Don't ruin the game for everyone else just because you have a hissy fit at the idea of other people playing in a manner that is outside your own acceptable ideals of how to play.

There is far too much of this attitude online lately. People all over, in so many games, constantly whining to have things taken away from other people just because THEY don't want to use them. It's not enough for them to exercise self control.. No, instead they feel some compulsion to try to force their ideal onto everyone else. It doesn't affect them. It doesn't affect you. It's none of you business. You have no vested interest in this product . Get over it and mind your own business? Please?

 

The only situation where anyone should be concerned about using cheap tactics to win would be in PVP but guess what? Other players CAN BREAK BLOCKS so it's not like you can wall people in and do this to them. By the logic I see presented there should be no progression since having armor and weapons stronger than the enemy would make them super easy. May as well just have everyone perpetually stuck with the same gear while we're at it eh?

 

That's why I said there probably isn't a way to fix it because it's a natural part of the game and tactics. Yes I realize that arrow slots have been used forever.

But it's not like archers in history have ran up to an encampment of soldiers, built a giant stone cage around them, and shot arrows through. Castles + arrow slots take awhile to build. Starbound, it's WAY too easy to make a cage with holes, making monsters too easy IMO. If there wasn't that artificial prevention of jumping to higher sectors, I could just go to level 100 planets from the start and walk my way around the planet collecting high level stuff. That's how easy it is.