Starbounders rejoice!

I must have missed the vote where you were designated delegate of the "We're not casual, you're hardcore" movement. Casual doesn't mean complete lack of challenge, it means you don't have to put forth dedicated effort to have a good time.

Casual Cosplayers are still Cosplayers, they just do it less frequently.
Casual Golfers are still Golfers, they just don't get paid (and are often times not-so-great at the game).
Casual Drinkers are still Drinkers, they just do so responsibly
You see where I'm going with this.

If you are a casual gamer, it's okay. There may be some kind of assumption of skill but really in the end, who cares? Do you really want to keep the company of people who will judge you based on your performance in a videogame?

What isn't okay is to automatically assume that your preferred experience should be the default one. It's even less okay to assume that everyone agrees with your point. This absolutely won't cause a "PR Nightmare" no matter how they handle it. That's something that no one here has the data to determine. As such, that decision falls on the Devs, and they've clearly spoken (though actions) on the matter.

PS. I dunno about you, but I think Angry Birds is fun xD

 

As a casual reader of this thread, I would like it more if they added checkboxes for some of the things like hunger and ore drop, but I think that they've made good steps and I'll find something in vanilla that I'll enjoy playing.

 

THIS. Letting the players decide what they want to deal with without other stuff lumped with it would be awesome.

 

You know, I've been saying that ever since it was revealed that you'd lose ores/ingots/coal on Nightlies and I kept getting shouted down by, well, Lintton, Maxwell (whatever the second half of his username is), darklight, and untrustedlife. M_Sypher may have interjected a few times sure, but now that I think about it, it was mainly those few I mentioned who always seemed the most opposed to making that stuff entirely optional, citing how it would be hard to code in (seriously?) or automatically assuming people who hated ore-drops on death wanted to be given what is essentially creative mode, jumping from one end of the spectrum to the other, somehow not getting a happy medium could exist.

 

The seocnd half of my name is "Demonic". It's a reference to the thought experiment "Maxwell's Demon" which is an illustration of the 2nd law of thermodynamics (through it's failure). It is also a reference to the fictional band "Maxwell Demon" from the movie Velvet Goldmine (which was also a reference to "Maxwell's Demon"). I hold no superstition thus "demon" holds no significant meaning to me.

Anyway, my opposition is purely based on the concept of "purity of the game experience", "artistic integrity in game design", and on the plethora of issues this would cause for multiplayer (as said options are stored on character, not universe). This is exactly the same reason I seldom use mods in other games (notable exceptions being Skyrim and Fallout "quality of life"-style mods). Additionally I've previously mentioned my personal distaste for massive and hard to decipher options panels. Part of my fear is one compromise and new option will lead to an avalanche of demands for new options. If those issues would be addressed, I wouldn't be opposed to it.

The last part of your 2nd run-on sentence is entirely false and I don't appreciate you spewing falsehoods. I have personally never stated that it would be "hard to code" and I've never "automatically assumed people who hated ore-drops on death wanted to be given what is essentially creative mode". Creative mode in other games is fun. I would love creative mode; but for the regular game, I want the experience the developers intended. If it's imbalanced, I'll complain, but give their vision a shot before crying that it's too punishing.

The crux of all of your arguments have been "I hate it an so will everyone else" which you somehow devised with your magical market-analysis and opinion-gathering superpowers. Come back with some actual evidence that people agree with you and I'll acquiesce.

EDIT: One final note. I haven't and won't "shout down" @Blitz of Wrath because they didn't start their suggestion by shouting of the apocalyptic ramifications of not removing ore-drops outright. If you took time to calmly explain why you think an option would be better and gave suggestions for implementing it, I don't think you'd have gotten such a frosty reception. Taking an "offended" tone immediately puts people off.

 

I was wondering about that, actually. I rarely deal with multiplayer anything, buuuuut... huh.

Which is the exact same arglebargle flung at people who didn't care about the hunger bar, except somehow conveniently in that circumstance it's a totally okay and valid argument tactic! Hooray!

(I wanna see that Venn diagram...)

Yyyyyyeah. You can only open-end a game so much. It's kinda obvious CF has a story they want to tell via this game, and a type of game they'd like to tell it with. An action-adventure with a massive building engine is... ambitious, to say the least, and the possibilities can come across as initially overpowering. I'm not sure giving new players a big ballot of stuff to check off right out of the gate is all that great an idea; it certainly invites the question "Why is this even in the game then?" And we've already seen that they need to put hard limiters on core elements to make it flow properly (dungeon protectors temporarily neutralizing the build engine, for example).

But they've also been more than open about making this game moddable as all hell, which is really nice.

We've got an incomplete, inaccurate snapshot of what they have planned for this game, and as such I'm very leery of just up and declaring what CF does as they announce it inherently wrong or too hard or too easy or a game-killer or whatever. And a long time on the net has taught me that cautious patience in the face of change generally works out waaay better for everyone. (Does the phase "TRUK NOT MUNKY" hold any significance to anyone else?)

 

The first half or so of Season one of BW was pretty bad compared to the rest, especially season 2 onwards.

 

Well I don't know how much of what's being said in this thread is true but here's my bullet-pointed thoughts:

- Not a fan of drop items on death, it should be there for those that like the danger but personally I would find it tedious
- I like having hunger, as it adds to the immersion and would like it available separately from item drop AND any nerfs designed for casual
- But I acknowledge that having a bunch of check-box options is a difficult-to-implement solution, not just for the extra coding but also for keeping the game well-balanced for everyone
- Worry that we will see all these arguements come back at next stable release, when a lot of players return

Solution from my POV is a 4th difficulty level:

- Casual - as described
- Easy - has hunger and other features of Normal, but only pixel drop on death
- Normal - as described
- Hardcore - as described

Should be easy to implement and address the majority of issues described in this and other recent threads.

 

I don't find that the ore drop is that much of an obstacle.

Just make sure to deposit ores you've gathered in a safe spot every now and then (Chests are plentiful for a reason). If they implement a local teleport system to allow you to immediately return to the surface (Using a player placed 2-way teleport or a one-use item for one-way return to ship) then it will become a complete non-issue past a certain point (When you get said teleport) of progression.

 

The silent people are being represented by the loud ones by not speaking up. Because they choose to remain silent. Should people be guessing at what they want? No.

 

You'd be surprised at the number of people that simply don't know this forum exists. There are people that have never actually read the launcher info and the only other way to find out about the website is the steam page (which has a tiny developer website link) or word of mouth. Remaining silent by choice is definitely an indication of abstaining, but most of the people that play this game don't have any clue these conversations are happening. It's a little like Ford saying the public is okay with them installing faulty seat-belts because no one said it wasn't okay.

 

Not so much that people don't know it exists, more that they other things going on in their lives

I've only come on here after noticing Armagon saying they were 'doing away' with the hunger bar in his dev post a couple weeks ago. A little worried about other changes to mechanics I might have missed...and how those following none of the developments and just waiting for steam to update are going to react :S

 

I don't know whats so hard about just making checkboxes and/or difficulty sliders for certain things. Isn't it just like, an on off thing? Like a bool switch? Wouldn't it be easier than having difficulty settings?

 

In most cases, no. Code is interdependant and "turning off" a section of it usually requires revisions to other sections of code. Which is why checkboxes would be an enourmous headache to code. The entire game's code would have to be able to accomodate any combination of checkboxes being selected/deselected. That would be a lot more difficult than having three modes with predefined functionality.

 

Jup, hence my suggestion of a 4th difficulty setting, above. Shouldn't have that issue, but still addresses the underlying problems.

 

My point is that they aren't relevant to the discussion because they aren't here and no one can claim to represent them.

Sorry, no, this isn't like that at all. This is like voting in an election, if you didn't vote you handed everyone that did your power to decide. That's what's happening in this thread right now.

 

We can guess what people like. That's the easy bit.

Finding a workable solution is the hard bit - as beta testers, we're meant to help that. That's what should be happening in this thread right now

 

I was playing a nightly build on normal at work I died but , I was disappointing that the only thing I dropped was my ore. I like the idea and the challenge of losing all my stuff when I die but, I can see why people don't find the fun in trying to retrieve or re farm items again. Instead of all this box adding nonsense why not just make more difficulty's to suit peoples needs. I like the survival aspect of these types of games not so much the building so I want to pump up the difficultly with hunger/thirst/sleep/ staying warm/cold(environmental stuff), weather, and whatever else to make my life hell bring it on. Though as far as settings go and what you lose on death i'd like to see something like what I have below and as you get past medium you see more stuff like dealing with hunger and trying to stay warm etc.

Very Easy- Lose nothing (maybe call it creative)
Easy - Lose Cash
Medium- Cash/Ores
Hard- Cash/Ores/Items
Very Hard - Perma Death

 

We need options not forced arbitrary modes. The point of the game is to be totally open, why would the game setting be different?

Even stuff like how hard monster hit could be on sliders.

 

Why am I not surprised that when they finally "fix" ore drops on death, people (who wanted this change) still find a way to complain.

"Casual" is a relative term. If your play style exists within a range of play styles, and your play style has the most handicaps, your play style is casual relative to the others. End of story. Even with only a few seconds of thought, getting ore can be done with literally 0 risk.

1. Get a pickaxe and torches.
2. Dig straight down.
3. Mine out any ore cavities and dig around caverns.
4. Reload game to teleport back to ship, loot intact.

No monsters. No fatal drops. No acid or lava. Getting ore is already the easiest thing in the game. If you refuse to use the ridiculous tools already in the game (building walls to trap monsters, mining ore from the ground and not from caves, using dirt to destroy lava, etc.), then you are throwing your own ores away.

If Dark Souls played like Starbound, you'd be able to arrive at Firelink Shrine, immediately dig down to the Kiln of the First Flame, box Gwyn in with some dirt blocks, and relink the fire. There's no good reason to want less risk in a game where you can do that, and that already has a godmode option. It's a waste of developer time.