So I just "Finished" the game, and im worried about its core mechanics

but...with all quests, you wont unlock at the end of tiers, you will unlock stuff progressively during tiers.
You wont have all the new tech upon reaching new tiers, now it's like that for testing purposes only.

 

Pretty sure they'll add difficulty modes at some point so you as well as the other people who don't want it so hard will both be happy.

 

can you beat the final mission in GTA without doing the first one? OH MY GOD YOU'RE RIGHT EVEN GTA IS LINEAR!!!

 

how would you fight a dragon first and a penguin later? you find any sense in that? a FREAKIN dragon...of course a dragon will be a later boss, it's suposed to be a lot harder to beat than a penguin...

 

Ive said it before, its probably getting a little repetitive by now, but i think a lot of the content will be for Sector X, 1 - 10 is just the Story and Handheld process similar to levelling in WoW, the full Sandbox experience will most likely be added to when you have geared up.

 

The only way not to have any linearity at all is to start a character, login, and instantly have everything unlocked. So basically you can chose right from the start to travel to the last sector and fight the last boss where his presence alone will kill you in one shot. Okay...so to stop that from happening you have to go through sector by sector to find gear good enough to move on. Oh wait, that's exactly what you do now...It's just an illusion. It's okay to do it when you aren't forced to, but when you are it's a problem?

Here's the only aspect of the game I am not a fan of in terms of linearity: don't require me to have to craft a lower tier metal in order to craft a higher tier metal! That, I totally agree, is a little forced. If I get gold ore I most certainly should be able to craft a gold pickaxe without first having to craft a copper one and silver one. I'm making a new tool, not coating my copper in silver, then coating it in gold. We should be able to make whatever we were lucky enough to find. A better, less forced way would be to make planets with with the higher tier metals less common.

 

Very true, and definitely acceptable if you ask me. Once you get to the infinite end sector, you aren't forced to do nothing you don't want to do.

 

When the title said you "finished" a sandbox game, I was expecting to read drivel. But you chose the title very well. Thank you very much for proving me wrong. I agree with almost everything you said. The formulaic progression from one "tier" to another is pretty shallow. And the rainbow of iron substitutes feels really lazy. Yeah it's beta, and yeah they're going to change things, but I think feedback like this, especially in early testing, will help the developers shape the game better.

Also, I hope they pay attention to this too:

Because this is really, really important. Higher tiers should never just be higher DPS, armor and hitpoints with new colors and names for the same ability. Higher levels are about introducing new mechanics, and changing the way the game plays by encouraging the player to incorporate new elements into their play style without invalidating the earlier mechanics. And this isn't possible without the introduction of situational abilities, which of course isn't possible without a variety of actual situations - which Starbound is sadly lacking atm.

Gnilbert

 

but its the "end game" therefore you had linearity throughout the whole game, you guys are giving the other guy a lot of bullets for his gun.

 

The only issue with this is it makes it more Action/Sandbox rather than RPG/Sandbox, if they did it in a way where a sword found in T1 is still good in T10, then where is the feeling of power progression? It wont matter how much time i sink into the game, my character will never feel like he is getting more powerful, only more knowledgeable. Currently the way it works is fine however i do feel there should be more to do per tier rather than just the constant mine and go that is there now. I like the idea of them introducing new aspects of the game per tier, like the pet system at T4. And given they are putting a story mode, with quests, and missions for the end of the tier rather than just a boss, its hard to make a sensible story when the player can pick and choose what part of the story they do first. (Also, pick and choosing in this style of game may work for some, but a lot will just take the path of least resistance, easy bosses first, harder later.)

 

Does your charachter feel like it's getting stronger the way things are now? With every tier being balanced around that tiers armor/weapons it doesn't feel like the game ever get's harder or easier, challenge remains the exact same in my opinion.

 

Not me, I've said from the start avoiding any linearity wouldn't even be fun, and avoiding it altogether is next to impossible. I've just been saying that those who find the "linearity" in a game like this irritating are the kind of people who have a playstyle of "get the best gear beat the best bosses reach end game", and generally aren't participating in the sandbox-geared gameplay styles such as exploring, doing all the random side quests, collecting rare items, and building awesome stuff.

The linearity in this game is the ocean. The linearity in Call of Duty Black Ops is a raindrop. Yes, technically both of those things are water. Both have linear aspects (no game doesn't). But the difference between them is vast.

 

The fact is, moving up 1 level of planet is like moving up 10. The system used to have 100 levels but was reworked in to 10 to refine it more. The game needs balanced, reworked and expanded, and all of that is planned, commenting on the "direction" or leveling/tier-ing system atm is moot, because it's vastly unfinished and unbalanced.

 

Hmm, well, I haven't put any thought on that point since I know the balancing is in its infancy. But isn't that kind of true for any and every game? Even old RPGs. Things get harder, but it's all balanced out by your characters getting stronger and better. Hard to make the game get harder in that sense. If it did you'd have the masses complaining that the game isn't balanced and they can't get past certain points because their gear isn't good enough.

But I think one way you could make the game harder is perhaps by adding more puzzles and dungeons with traps (perhaps more enemies). Or with enemies that attack in new and different ways that require more skill and smarter tech use. And I think that's exactly what we will see.

 

I wasn't intending that a weapon you found at T1 would still be useful at level T10 - or even T2! I was talking more about the mechanics of using the type of weapon you found at T1, and say that that type of weapon would still be useful at T10. Let's say that at T1 you have swords with a basic slashing attack - that type of attack would still be (at least situationally) useful on T10 content, even if the sword looks a lot cooler at that point. It's just that other types of weapons (like plasma guns, grenades, psychokinesis) have been introduced through the tiers that let you mix up your tactics to better fit the situation - all without introducing weapon types that are completely dominated by another.

The other side of that is introducing new movement or utility abilities that change your ability to position, setup, or otherwise game the earlier abilities, extending their power.

Gnilbert

 

Thats a little more reasonable yes, but it would still need to have damage differences and such, but if different weapon types had different status effects, that would definately add to the variety

 

I haven't read this entire thread so I will just post the points I agree and disagree with with.

AGREE:

Low level armor is made obsolete too quickly. The crafting menu needs to get organized better. I don't really mind the power creep that exists in the game, but I DISLIKE the level-gated sectors (which should be replaced by one seamless universe of varying difficulty). The matter manipulator becomes useless in the first five minutes of the game and should not even occupy an inventory space unless it is expanded upon. Having too many different types of ore in the game is kind of useless if they are made trivial with every tier (having no reason to return to lower level ores). And yes, after the first time those "shrine things" insta-killed me, I never touched one again.

DISAGREE:

Terraria was amazingly fun and I don't see a problem with this being "Terraria 2 with space and extra stuff". I knew what I was getting into from the screenshots while purchasing the game. Having content that cannot be crafted is a good thing and gives more incentive for exploring to search for these things. There are plenty of reasons to build a home. Not all reasons have to be measured in monetary/material benefit/gain. I will build a giant city on a planet because I want to and the process will be fun. I like your idea for solar panels though. After seeing 15 random planets, I'm still excited to discover what other planets look like. The overall game mechanics on planet surface might be the same, but there are plenty of unique biome designs (so I disagree with "once you've seen one, you've seen them all" kind of viewpoint). I don't want facility-sized contraptions on my world to "auto-produce" ore while I'm not around. It just seems unnecessary as nothing in-game demands (or ever will demand) that much ore. I'm pretty sure that's not really possible in this game anyway as even growing plants relies on you being within a certain proximity of the garden. Besides, didn't you say most ore was useless? Why are you advocating mass refineries of ore, when you say it's of no use by endgame? Seems a bit antithetical right? And finally, the nomad lifestyle attracts a lot of people to the game and it's a mechanic plenty of people enjoy. We have a choice in this game to be nomad or settle down. Choices are good. Limiting or disicentivising choices because a few people dislike them is bad.

 

"Step 1: Go underground and mine "insert leveled ore here"
Step 2: Make armor and weapons of "insert leveled ore here" so you dont die instantly on the surface
Step 3: Run around the map mining fuel ore and "insert leveled ore here" hoping to find some random crate/event to give you something you can not get through crafting
Step 4: Build the item required to advance your crafting/Defeat the boss if there is one"


That is all there is a nutshell atm yeah. I'm surprised I'm still playing actually. I just got to the third stage, build a cool house and now I hit a wall.
Seems all there is to do is go round the planet, find some generic buildings with loot if you're lucky and go dig for ore. And farming off course.
All the while fighting monsters with a very basic control system. (I don't have a gun still, especially birds are stupid to fight)
I think I will start to look up coordinates and hunt for some cool tech or something.

Or wait a few months and enjoy the new content.

 

You do realize that the point of a beta is for the developers to get feedback from the players? Both on things that work well and are liked, and things that players think doesn't work very well or arn't adding anything to the experience. Just saying, the "this is beta" argument is dumb and used to death here. People give their thoughts on things because it's in beta...