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Sniper Buff

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Stovepipes, Nov 10, 2013.

  1. Stovepipes

    Stovepipes Void-Bound Voyager

    I really like the concept of the sniper and he's quite fun to use, but he is vastly underpowered when compared to other classes...His major weakness lies in his inability to tackle large groups of mobs (which compose most of the gameplay) due to his heavy reliance on being able to sit for a good 5 seconds before actually shooting. His shots are obscenely powerful but he fires so slowly that enemies can simply overwhelm him.

    My suggestion is to give the sniper some native means of buying time for him to place a charged shot. Whether that be through stunning enemies, a brief state of invincibility, or some other method doesn't really matter. As it stands, the sniper gets overtaken much quicker than any other class, which makes his ridiculously powerful shots irrelevant, especially when considering that those shots require a fairly large amount of set up time anyway.

      KRAZEEE Orbital Explorer

      I think the sniper could be more balanced by either lowering the reload animation or letting his basic attacks pierce after a perfect reload
      • Stormquake

        Stormquake Scruffy Nerf-Herder

        I think it'd be better to have basic AND charged shots pierce with a perfectly reloaded bullet rather than just basic. Then he'd be a true high skill class, rewarding players for good timing and being able to manage enemies and themselves to get off a maximum charged shot.
        • jadkni

          jadkni Space Spelunker

          Right now, you can (and should) mostly ignore perfect reloads unless you're lining up an Aim in favor of just mashing Z and kiting crowds around. Kind of a shame, really. It's an interesting mechanic that usually isn't worth actually paying attention to.
          • Magnamara

            Magnamara Space Spelunker

            Ironic,... the sniper mob can aim you in any direction.. You can't aim ¬¬
            Steady shot should enable when charging aim with the movement keys, up or down.
            • DJFlare84

              DJFlare84 Spaceman Spiff

              I agree that the sniper needs some help, but I have a slightly different view on it.

              The guy can tackle large groups of mobs alright if you hit-and-run. You won't get a full charge, but constant half-charges will eventually reduce a swarm to shreds.

              I feel like his most inexcusable fault is his near inability to properly handle mobs in tight spaces. He needs to have lots of room to move around and distance himself to work effectively, but a lot of areas in the game force you to fight on ledges with very little running space. Situations like that are when things get impossible for the Sniper.

              I hate to say it because it sounds uncreative, but giving him the ability to aim at targets during Steady Aim is the best way to fix it. Nevermind. SmokeScreen is a much better idea.

              Sniper is all about distance. Jumping into the thrall with a sniper rifle is a rookie mistake, and a common sniper-tombstone headline. and a game that forces you to do this has a serious problem, with all due respect.
                Last edited: Nov 13, 2013
                Stovepipes likes this.
              • ipsum

                ipsum Twenty-three is number one

                I feel like the sniper's basic attack is redundant. Essentially, you can pull off the same thing by firing his charge shot immediately. It would make more sense to get rid of his basic attack entirely, and give him some sort of stun or slow. His charge shot could be moved to basic attack, with tapping the button just making him fire a quick shot, and leaving it pressed will charge it.

                Backflip and SCAN are great, he really just needs one more tool at his disposal.
                  Auraknight likes this.
                • blorx

                  blorx Aquatic Astronaut

                  I was all set up to agree with everyone in this thread and say that sniper is a weak class, but last night I actually managed a hardcore win with him and he seems very capable. Admittedly he needs a bit more luck with fast teleporter finds, but the sniper still seems to be a very strong class. I find that getting a laser drone or two can help, since he generally wants to stay out of crowds anyway and it shouldn't be that hard to survive to the third stage in order to find one (since you almost always will find one in the third stage).

                  His crowd control does seem weak, and it is fair to say that with no items he's going to fail quickly, but all characters will have trouble with no items, he just needs speed boosts and such where other classes need healing items. If you have issues fighting in tight spaces (a legitimate issue, but for all classes) then run away, he can do that quite well; no stage is entirely made of tight spaces.
                  • Stormquake

                    Stormquake Scruffy Nerf-Herder

                    Engineer don't need no items. ENGINEER DON'T CARE. AIN'T NOBODY GOT TIME FOR THAT.
                      ggh325 likes this.
                    • Raruna

                      Raruna Space Spelunker

                      I found that like blorx said, getting Drones helps a lot.
                      If you have two or three Drones, they can usually keep enemies at bay long enough for a decently charged shot, and deal very well with his "can only attack horizontally" problem. Plus, the Sniper might be bad at crowd control, but by far he's the best at killing bosses, so it's a decent trade-off. Nothing beats a charged shot with the scanner. Love seeing a third of the level boss's HP vanishing in one go.
                      • LazerusKI

                        LazerusKI Phantasmal Quasar

                        pierce on a perfect reload sounds interesting, way better than the extra damage thing.
                        his style is simply way to slow, too single-target based.
                        he either needs to have a slow RoF and hit multiple targets, like the Enforcer
                        or a bigger magazine for his rifle
                        ...or a cloaking mechanic, replacement for backflip or while he is standing still...
                        there are so many way of how to rebalance him...but something should be done
                        • hat_crime

                          hat_crime Space Hobo

                          In my opinion there should be some sort of link between Steady Aim and Military training to create a dynamic where accuracy is rewarded with the mobility to line up more shots. To me this would be accomplished by changing Steady Aim from being a charged shot to a mark effect where the first use marks a target and from then on successfully hitting the marked target would deal bonus damage to that target and killing the marked target would refresh Military training.
                          • DJFlare84

                            DJFlare84 Spaceman Spiff

                            The point I was making about the Sniper lacking ability in tight spaces was that SOMETIMES YOU KINDA HAVE TO.

                            Like, say you're in the ice level and the gate is all geared up and ready to take you out of there, but you've got a crowd of 12 or so monsters sitting on a short ledge, and not the kind of ledge where there's another nearby you can snipe from.

                            What's a Sniper to do, then? All he can do is pray that he gets a good crowd-clearing item like Jar of Souls before hitting that point or he's completely screwed.

                            Other characters can handle this MUCH better. In fact you'd be hard pressed to find a character that DOESN'T have at least a mildly decent response to this kind of situation.

                            Commando, Enforcer, Huntress and Bandit have rapid-fire capability so they can pretty much jump right in and start shootin' the hell out of things. And more importantly, they can move around and jump and dodge WHILE attacking. Sniper, as you may recall, HAS TO SIT STILL FOR A SECOND. Now, imagine doing that in a crowd and then go "... oooooh...".

                            Engineer can jump in and spam turrets and landmines. Hell... Engi doesn't have a problem with ANY situation. Engi is the master race.

                            Miner, Acrid and Mercenary are melee classes so this is kind of their thing. Dunno about Han-D because I haven't unlocked him but I imagine he handles similarly.

                            So, yeah. "You don't HAVE to" doesn't help when you kinda DO have to. Very often, in fact.

                            And I like this suggestion. I like it a lot.

                            The main attack IS pretty redundant. And would Steady Aim be OP if we removed the cooldown? I don't think so, somehow. If this change were to occur, I'd like to see the Sniper get some kind of homing missile attack. Or maybe a skill that lets him drop a smokescreen on the ground right at his position that protects him from getting hit at all for a short duration, then he could fight on that ledge...
                              Last edited: Nov 13, 2013
                              Stovepipes and LazerusKI like this.
                            • ipsum

                              ipsum Twenty-three is number one

                              Smokescreen that gives 100% dodge! I like!
                              • SPLlT

                                SPLlT Big Damn Hero

                                Perhaps 100% movespeed while rifle isn't loaded, 150% on normal reload, 175% on almost-perfect reload, 200% on perfect reload? (Movespeed is limited to a few seconds of course, otherwise this would be somewhat overpowered.)
                                And allow the steady aim skill to have infinite pierce on perfect reloads?

                                This would allow the sniper more movement to get ready and more crowd control ability...
                                Although many would argue that sniper is more of a 1v1 class.
                                • blorx

                                  blorx Aquatic Astronaut

                                  The biggest issue I see with that change is that a sniper with no enemies in sight will still jump up and down in the air to reload and shoot constantly, which would just end up being tedious and give the sniper nearly permanent move speed buffs.
                                  • DJFlare84

                                    DJFlare84 Spaceman Spiff

                                    Agreed. Although I like the idea of the Steady Aim having infinite pierce. I really don't see why not, considering that the Commando's Full Metal Jacket does exactly that...

                                    Oh wait, he said on Perfect Reloads. THAT seems a bit OP maybe...
                                    • SPLlT

                                      SPLlT Big Damn Hero

                                      Yes it does seem like there will be some trouble balancing the sniper class in the respect of evading enemies :/

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