PSA: Constructive feedback vs [mostly] useless complaints, and the "It's beta!" excuse.

Honestly I should have done this sooner, but I didn't, so here we are.

Listen up people, there's a couple things that need to be sorted. First, people need to learn the difference between feedback (which is what Chucklefish is looking for), and complaints that really do not much more than spam up the forum. Second, people need to understand the "It's beta!" excuse isn't valid.

The difference between feedback and complaints is actually very simple.

Feedback is where you point out something you perceive as a flaw with the game, and then clearly state how you believe the perceived flaw can be fixed. Keep in mind that in almost all cases, your feedback is personal opinion, so don't try to frame your feedback as fact / absolute truth.

Complaints on the other hand, are where you just state what you perceive as a flaw, without providing any possible solutions to the flaw. Granted, acknowledging a flaw is useful to some degree, as it allows people to become aware of it. However, without providing possible solutions, you aren't really contributing to the effort to fix the perceived problem.

Someone who doesn't contribute, is just freeloading. Freeloaders in testing hinder progress.

Now on to the other point of this thread. Quite simply, people posting "It's beta!" need to just stop. Even if the person is just complaining, they are still providing at least a small contribution to the process. In other words, they're doing their part to progress the game, even if it is only a very tiny part.

 

What if you don't know how to fix the flaw. I actually think that your ideas to fix something are a lot less important then how you feel about something. We aren't game devs. Trying to fix the game is somewhat out of our depth. We know what we feel we know what feels wrong, but we don't always know how to fix that feels wrong. Offer ideas if you have them sure, but I don't think they are required.

 

I do not completely agree with your opinion that people who are complaining are doing their part to progress the game. Looking back to your own distinction between complaining and feedback, I can agree with that much. Folks who give feedback when they encounter something they don't like, are absolutely adding positive value to the forums and game. On the other hand, folks who are complaining without positing any possible solution are not adding value to the forums or game.

Furthermore, folks who are posting long winded posts about why Starbound has "failed" due to missing features, etc. at this point, are also not contributing to the game and forums. In point of fact, I believe those folks are willfully oblivious at this point with the fact that the developers stated in advance how beta was going to work. They specifically stated that the first stage of beta was going to be incomplete, that features would be added, and that balancing would need to take place.

Having said all that, I feel that all of these people should still be allowed to make posts on the forums whether offering feedback or complaining, provided they keep it respectful.

 

Just like with anything people get passionate about any game they have built up a desire to play. There are cases were people may have thought one thing and learned it was going to be another.

My impression of what makes good criticism and useful information for developers is clear examples of issues they face and how it affects them or if they don't understand something at least be clear so those misunderstandings can be corrected by the community. Suggestions should be left in suggestions and bugs should be left in bugs. So the remaining items such as balance, content etc is what we should be expecting to read here.

The vitriol here can be difficult for some to swallow. However, it isn't much more then any other game or beta that I have been in. In some cases, the it's beta is acceptable but they should at least be able to point to something and say they are planning on addressing this or its not applicable or whatever.

 

There are cases when "IT'S BETA" Is pretty valid.

threads that say "Not enough weapons" and "Not enough ore", Or even "No endgame" earn the "It's beta" treatment.

 

even if you don't have an all-encompassing idea for a solution that covers everything you envision, if you feel that something is flawed, you should have at least a very basic idea of how you would go about fixing it. even the slightest minute bit of an idea is infinitely more helpful than nothing at all.

yes, respect is very important and something that is very often ignored. however, it can be argued that posting "useless complaints" is disrespectful to chucklefish.

just because there's vitriol in every beta, doesn't negate the fact that it shouldn't exist. it isn't helpful, and usually causes rippling issues that are hard to reign in.

those types of threads are just spam at the end of the day, and should be treated as such (report and move on, don't even post)

 

Complaints are feedback.

No, you are wrong. There is no indication that these things are going to change, and if they are then something like "this feature isn't implemented yet" or whatever are proper responses.

 

to put it bluntly: you are wrong.

for reasons why, go ahead and read the OP.

 

Read the daily/weekly updates. New tiers, New endgame, New bosses, New everything.

 

So like this thread you've made here than...

 

I agree that the "It's BETA" excuse is ridiculous, but not for the same reasons. A lot of the complaints by people are about core design decisions. Screaming BETAAAAA over and over means nothing in that case. Bugs, unbalanced mobs (UFO), etc are cases where the game being in Beta actually means something.

One thing about complaints. I can disagree with something, and not have a solution. That's O.K. I don't buy into that whole "well, do you think you can do it better?" logic. I don't have to be able to do something better to say something is not good. I can hear something play the violin and realize it's not very good without having violin lessons myself.

 

Perhaps. But, that assumes complaints are useless. Like the OP, I don't think that is the case. I think that complaints do serve a purpose, however, I also believe they do not add much value to the discussion in general for affecting true change on the game itself.

The developers have stated, before beta began, that Stage 1 was not going to be "content complete." That in itself is an indicator that the complaints about not enough items, ore, or endgame content are going to be addressed, right? Or am I misunderstanding you?

 

"BUT IT'S JUST A BETA" doesn't really work anyway because the game is an alpha.

 

I read what you wrote. Maybe you should write it differently. Maybe you should look up the definition of "complaint" while you're at it, since you seem to have "complaining" confused with "ranting".

That's a proper response. Was that hard? Would "it's a beta" have told me a goddamned thing? No.

 

i was very clear in what i wrote, and considering you're the only one who isn't getting it...

 

Its beta is a very valid response especially in response to things like OMG THE GAME SUCKS NOTHING WORKS AND THERE IS NO CONTENT.

 

No. What you are describing is called bug reporting, and should be done in the bug reporting threads. You do not need to have a solution to offer, to report flaws. More often than not, your "solutions" (not having any idea what the back-end looks like) are worthless anyhow. Report flaws, bugs, criticism and complaints.

 

I think someone from the dev team made a statement a while ago, clarifying what his definition of a beta is. Said something among the lines of "its not what most people nowadays see as beta, where everything is near feature complete" etc etc, but dont quote me on that, maybe im confusing things. (Its early in the morning, and i need coffee..)

 

I don't see "beta is beta" as being an excuse; it's merely a fact. Sometimes people seem to expect a complete game, and those expectations are misplaced. The game is incomplete at this stage, there's no getting around that, and people who wish to play a complete game should wait until release.

 

Its a matter of how you package your "complaints" imho.
Saying "the game is currently to hard" or "wont work on XP, please fix, i wanna play" is largely different from "OMG wtf is this shit, feature bla is not in though they said it would be in the (final) game, i want a refund now".
Generally i have seen some people complaining about known issues in a very unfriendly or outright insulting manner, and this is where i think "man chill, its beta" surely does apply.