I do believe he stated his arguments before that post. In the end it's just a matter of tastes. What I can tell is that your comment was indeed quite harsh, plainly saying that his idea "was.stupid". I mean, come on, there's no need to make a counter argument that starts with that sentece, which you also try to emphasize with italics and full stops.
He did not reply to the argument which I posed against his "Minecraft's durability was good" thing, and I didn't say that his idea was stupid; materials having three or four qualities is fine, but at one point it becomes overcomplicated.
Too many stats bogs it down, and having to constantly worry about durability and wear and tear means all the action and exploration gets diluted in favor of micromanaging every single piece of your equipment. Maybe materials could have a few types to them out of several possible, and recipes would require a materials be of a certain type, but when you throw in way too many numbers, most players are going to wish they didn't have to spent so much time comparing abstracts on two resources every time they want to craft (or god forbid, repair) an item.
THIS, THIS IDEA, THIS ONE. CHUCKLEFISH, LOOK. IMPLEMENT THIS. With this in the game, finding, crafting and collecting would never be boring OR pointless. He has a perfect point...(sue me for this next sentence) look at Terraria, once you hit a given point in the game, the only reason you'll go back looking for let's say...iron ore, is to help out a friend. What if none of your friends play, or what if you already helped them? That's an entire experience you'll never experience again. I'd like to think that a major idea behind the creation of Starbound is the desire to KEEP playing for a LONG time. With this idea implemented, that would be possible even if you halted development (don't do dat)! Genius idea here, congrats sir poster. ;D [EDIT] I'd like to say that material gathering should be balanced. It shouldn't be too casual OR too time-consuming. I wanna be able to go about business having gathered materials I need for a project later down the line I couldn't have predicted, but I also want moments where I have to work hard or think hard to gather the necessities I need for a project I just learned of (like...bosses, oya ;D). Pacing...another important aspect of gaming.
You are going to have come up with really good reasons that Tiy should add durability to the game as he strongly opposes it. So far I am yet to see a good reason. I too oppose this as I see fun more important than realism. Here is the quote from Tiy: Durability <@Tiy> durability sucks too <@Tiy> time sink <@Tiy> grind <@Tiy> blerhg
I discovered a lost gem, it looks like that similar ore do take up an individual slots even though they are near identical looking ingots take up different slots. Which there are not a lot of inventory slots in the first place.
It's not about realism. It's about not having nothing to do once you start getting the top gear. I don't know about other people but for me, mining and exploring didn't have the same appeal or urgency once I got good gear in Terraria. I literally could spend hours and never have to dig a single block later in the game.
That is what level 100 planets are for, they are always a challenge. There could also be miscellaneous quests that lead you there so you can feel like you are doing something important.
You're misunderstanding. I know there can always be challenges by increasing difficulty. I want there always to be a reason to explore and mine.
You really put you're mind into it, i agree with most of you're statements of the mining only higher level tiers which can get pretty boring. This makes prefect sense and would love to see you're idea come into play!
From what I've understood crafting in Starbound involves using blueprints from NPCs and climbing up a tech tree somehow. There aren't ores, either. Not in Minecraft/Terraria sense anyway. You can mine for some sort of materials though. It'd probably be possible to have weapon blueprints accept materials of different qualities. That is, assuming we can craft weapons in the first place! A Borderlands/Diablo-like drop system would be pretty wasted on a game where you just craft the best stuff. It's a cool idea none the less.
I think this is a great idea! I also think it could be very possible to put into the game; the attribute of the material would affect the item that would be crafted by where it was on the blueprint, which would be rather cool! There might be a need for 'special' sets of materials as well, of which would make specific and unique items that would prove more difficult to procedurally generate. But perhaps those too could have randomized stats based on the materials used! As for durability, perhaps rather than having them break they would just lose effectiveness over time, and then you would need to repair them. Or perhaps it would make armor or weapons more effective in harsher climates; one could last longer in a snowy tundra or the like. That way you won't have to craft your items over and over, which I agree can be a bit of a pain.
I think for durability, something you want to avoid is having gradual decay of effectiveness. What this encourages is repairing after each use to keep your item at 100% effectiveness. Instead, have the item retain all its power throughout its durability life and then, when it hits 0 durability, simply have its power become maybe 1/20th of its full strength. That way, people don't feel like they need to repair every single time they use an item.
I think that the durability should be a choice of how it works depending on the player's preference. As I stated in another thread (I would link it, but I don't know how to link to other threads ) durability should be kinda like a difficulty level of some sort, kinda like terraria had soft medium and hardcore. Softcore would be no durability, medium would be reduced effectiveness once the durability ran out, hard would be gradual lose of effectiveness as the durability drops and then there could be a fourth difficulty where it would be like hardcore but once you lost all durability the item broke and couldn't be used, but could be repaired to use again but with a percent of its max effectiveness permanently gone. (not a stacking effect, would only apply after the first time it happened) It would probably make everyone happy if this was the kinda system used to determine it, so everyone can play the way they like, or close to it.
I like this idea a lot! Maybe durability could even be a separate "slider" so that you could control it independently of difficulty.
Wow, it seems like this durability thing is a hot topic for it to still be discussed in this thread for as long as it was. lol OT: Material variations are an excellent addition to this game, however, the logistics are a little more complicated than i think you all realize. For starter, the client could store all 'found' values of discovered materials. In this case, you are slowly creating what has the potential to take up a ton of space, simply for varied materials. This can be remedied by having material stats condensed to a few base values: Hardness (not durability, which i think could be implemented if done right, and could make everybody happy if people stopped arguing and worked out the issues) Temperature Resistance Opaqueness (very important, and yet somehow ignored so far...what gives?) Hue Obviously, texture difference (could be the trait that opaqueness is a sub-trait of) Special characteristic (this field in the database can hold all necessary qualities for rare or specialized materials, such as bio-resistance, corrosion-resistance...etc) That's six categories, several of which are immediately important, and can be seen readily, and several of which a player could unlock the ability to see with tech improvements in the lab. That way, the new player isn't face-melted with data-points, and advanced players have something to look forward to in their extensive adventures. Things like Hardness, Opaqeness, hue and texture should be readily apparent, and in-fact, the only ones needing textual reference are hardness and texture (i.e. slippery/bumpy/sticky). So that's TWO STATS that beginning players have to figure out. Not a lot. Temperature resistance can be represented by a stable temperature range for a given material, and initially, players may figure it out by accident by: dropping stuff in lava to see if it floats/bursts in to flame/freezez/dances a jig...etc. The more advanced stats could be represented in a textual dialog much like the one represented in the OP, but you only need just a few lines to do it right. No need to add unnecessary complexity, complexity is emergent in most cases. So basically, your material's special characteristic(s) become visible through laboratory examination. This gives you ONLY the required stats for that particular item (some having only one or less special characteristics, and some with four or five). These materials can be made more rare than others so that they are uncovered even later in game, and that leaves you still with early-game procedural materials, that at least have SOME stat variance. To balance things out, the more advanced/rare materials don't have to be made over-powered or anything. They could be generated with some random weaknesses to balance their other special characteristics(or maybe the special characterstic IS their weakness). Also, materials with a LOT of special characteristics will be of a far greater rarity, of course. In terms of durability, their is no reason NOT to have it, if it is done correctly. I would suggest that items with light use involved have no durability consideration at all, and items that are rigorously used i.e.: picks, shovels, guns, degrade exceptionally slowly at first. If they fully degrade, they almost fully refund their component materials used to make them (or fully refund, whichever floats your boat). BTW, minecraft was stupid for not doing all their items this way. They did with boats and minecarts though.
