Ocean now is the best fishing spot for the Spring?

The 1.4 add some new fish into the game, one of them is called "Flounder" that by any means is a ocean LM.Bass.

They stay for one hour longer than the Bass, the beach is also a place for forageables and maybe now the amount of time fishing and foraging will be worth the difference, the only downside that I found is that the ocean have two small catches (anchovy and herring) against one from the montain lake (carp), Sardine is a less powerfull version of Chub but Hallibut beats the Bullhead.

 

Adding the Flounder is nice, but it doesn't do anywhere near enough to bring the ocean into the lead. Here's why


From the farm, the travelling time to both is about the same, so whatever you do on the farm in the morning, you're getting to both at about the same time, so the ocean doesn't gain any edge there

But, the Halibut completely disappears between 11am and 7pm, leaving the ocean with just the Flounder (100g) and three terrible value fish (30g, 30g and 40g) for eight whole hours, and none of them are good value to eat. By comparison, the lake has the Largemouth Bass (100g) and the other three are 75g, 50g and 30g, and all of them are there all day. Furthermore, in terms of lowest g/E, the chub is the best fish to eat in the game, alongside the Smallmouth Bass.

Another consideration in favour of the lake is that if you stand on the second island and zoom out to the max, you can see almost the whole lake, and therefore take advantage of almost any bubbles that spawn, to get fish bite faster. At the ocean, you can't see anywhere near all of the water, so the bubbles are much more likely to spawn off screen, and even when you are lucky enough to see bubbles, most of the water is completely out of reach, so most bubbles would be out of reach too.


At the lake you will earn more money and XP, and it's not even close

 

True, I also see the miss of the chub as a huge deal, but something to consider is that the ocean is near of the spring onions.

 

Since you have to go to the ocean day 2 this does seems to warrant looking into once you factor in the travel time from the beach to the mountain lake.
And, if you need to go to the beach in the am for day 3 to buy the rod, again maths will be needed.

I'm going to look at those next after I finish the tulip puzzle I've presented myself.
But I do think the mountain still wins out at the moment.

 

I'm a little puzzled at the spring onions seemingly being a big deal. Do you find them every day? I don't even bother checking them very often any more, because I've been there so many times and found nothing. The first time it's usually 'full', but after that I'm lucky to find 1-2. Just seems like a waste of time.

This is late game in year 3 with skill 10, but recently I've been fishing in the lake because I don't have all that much to do, and I genuinely find it relaxing to just stand there and fish all day -- as opposed to running hither and tither. I was surprised at just how much money it fetched. Even if I discount the treasure chest (the one with 5000g value) and various emeralds from chests, I got 7-8000g worth of fish after spending 8-10 hours fishing per day. Lingcod is often downright impossible without a bobber (unless you happen to get a relatively calm one) and their value isn't much to write home about anyway, so those were mostly lost. But Tiger Trout has very good value, and Pike is good too.

That's probably unrealistic in the very early game, not least because you need to eat some of it (500+ energy sure helps in the late game), but how much do you actually fish up in thos early days?

Admittedly that area doesn't look so good during spring due to low-value fish like sunfish and smallmouth bass, but probably still a good location on Fridays and Sundays, since you want to check out the pig cart anyway. And as mentioned, I've found it surprisingly lucrative during winter.

 

Spring onions are overrated after day 1.

I mean, it might be worth it if you check and then decide whether to reset the day, but I think you need to find plenty of them to make it worth the detour. If there's not many then it's just two hours of wasted time. And onions aren't really that close to the ocean anyway; it's probably just as far to walk from onions to ocean as it is to walk from farm to mountain lake. And as I said, even though we now have the Flounder, the ocean is still a dead loss because the Halibut goes AWOL for 8 hours

Ocean is only worth it on day 2 if you're really pushing a min-max approach and intend to buy the fiberglass rod at about lunchtime that day. But otherwise, the complete absence of a second money fish for 8 whole hours means that the lake will win every time, even with a walk.

As for day 3, you should be fishing the river if you can get catfish, and the mountain lake if you can't.

This is about the mountain lake, not the cindersap lake.

As for how much can be caught, if you save all your fish and wait until you are Fishing 10 before selling with the 50% bonus, the new iridium quality tier means you can rake in somewhere near 10k per day from fishing, even in early spring

 

Oh sorry, how on earth did I write "lake" there.. It was meant to be river, as in the river south of Leah's cabin.

And err... I know you are min-maxing harder than diamonds, but fishing from day 2 onwards for however long, and then saving the fish until you hit Fishing 10 to make a bit more gold? All this meta-playing kinda does my nut in. Do you actually get enjoyment out of that? Is the drive for perfectionism?

 

I take my fish from day 3 and day 4 and sell night 4 if I have reached fishing 5 which is usually the case with the 25% bonus. That 3k to 4k (depending on the farm) funds my day 5 purchase of backpack and either crops for the 6th or the tool upgrade on the 6h. Since I have no need for money until the 5th I can get away with holding off for the bonus.

After that I sell fish. I've not ever held fish back to gain the full bonus from 10. But I also don't push fishing and level10 until later. If the plan was to only fish until level 10 was reached I could hear an argument for it. <maybe> What is the current record? I think folks have hit it pretty quickly I think in fishing 10 run games.


-Question on the fish type probabilities. Is each fish equally likely to be caught as the other during each given hour or is there a chart somewhere that spells out the chances?

 

From my perspective, I get a different sort of enjoyment out of trying to challenge myself and see how much I can do, versus playing casually and messing around. Which one is more fun depends how I'm feeling that day. Also fun in a different way is throwing around ideas and theorycrafting the best way to achieve goals, without necessarily putting them in practice (or even having the skill to put them in practice).
Would it make more sense to you if I compared it to, say, competitive swimming? There's a lot of people who swim for fun and wouldn't want to spend hours of time training to learn how to do it faster. And then there are people who really enjoy pushing themselves to go as fast as they can. It's sort of like that, except a lot less likely to make you fit

I think it was day 8 or 9? That was on 1.3, I assume people could do it slightly faster by using the training rod day 2.

I don't think there's a chart anywhere online, but the probabilities are different for each fish and they also depend on the water depth you're casting into. IIRC, water depth is based on what tile you're fishing in but it's basically a measure of how far the bobber is from shore.
From what I understand this is how it works (at least in 1.3, but I can't imagine why CA would have changed it):

• First, the game gets a list of all fish that are possible (e.g. for the mountain lake in Spring before 7pm, that list would be carp, chub, bullhead, and largemouth bass).
• Then the game randomizes the order of that list. For example, it might randomly choose the order "bullhead, carp, bass, chub".
• Then it looks up the probability for the first fish. This is based on what the fish is, and also what water depth you're fishing at. E.g. bullhead might be 30% probability at depth 1, and 70% probability at depth 3. (I have no idea if these numbers are even in the right ballpark).
• Then it gets a random number between 0 and 1. If that number is less than the probability of the first fish, you get that fish on the line. If not, it tries the same calculation with the second fish, and so on. If you don't catch any of the fish in the list, you get trash. (I'm not sure if seaweed/algae is counted as a fish or as trash for these purposes).

The fish probabilities are always higher in deeper water (farther from shore), which is why you get less trash when you're a higher fishing level and can cast farther.

 

Thanks for that. I enjoy the theorizing as well.
I ran some numbers and will have to check them now. It appears that the dart properties of the ocean fish are what make the mountain lake "better". Without fish type I'm generating dollers per catch numbers that are closer than I expected, especially considering the early hours missed fishing largemouth while travelling to the lake.

But the increase in star quality which raises prices and xp for the perfect casts is the kicker. Carp are awesome a 2.4x. and so are bull head. And they are there nearly the easiest fish of the lot, all day long. more later with better numbers.

 

This was a point I was going to make. Although carp are still... let say, carp even with the perfect catch. Especially after iridium fish started showing up, perfect catches are even more important for both xp and gold. And ocean fish, even the cheapest ones, are hard to perfect catch. Since this latest version, I've actually switched to the town river as my preferred day 2 spot in the afternoon/evening. Smallmouth, sunfish and bream all average pretty low base gold and xp-wise... BUT from Fishing Skill 2 on, I can almost 100% perfect every single one. That makes a huge difference, speeds you up to skill 4 when you start catching iridium, which speeds you up even more. Plus, you're more likely to get a perfect catch with a chest (5.28x) there on average. Plus the fishing spot is closer than both the other two. The only disadvantage is not being able to sell them right there, so that's why I usually do the ocean on the morning of the 2nd.

 

Yeah, if your aim is to really push fishing hard, with the aim of spending the whole of day 3 catching catfish, the only thing that really matters on day 2 is XP, and those perfects in the town will really rack it up fast. If you're super good at fishing that you can still get mostly perfect chub even at Fishing 2 (some are, wish I was) then maybe the lake is still ahead despite the extra journey time, but I know I'm not good enough at chub to even make it worth bothering to test. I suspect it's much better than town if you also have a really good day 1 in terms of selling stuff for money, and can afford all the bait you need for day 3 without needing to hang around the ocean until 5pm, because you also get there long before the Largemouth disappears, which will compensate even more for the time lost to travelling.

I also reckon it's not impossible to get to Fishing 5 on day 2, especially if you get some good bubbles. But the closest I've ever managed is just under halfway from Fishing 4 to 5, and that was in town.

 

Yeah, a full day bubbles (or at least half) can get you to 5. But not even counting the xp buff, the difference between an iridium smallmouth (100g) and a gold sardine (60g) is significant. In fact, the gold sardine is tied with an iridium sunfish, and there's 2 worse ocean fish to deal with. Even if you manage to get flounders, you're usually looking at silver (125g), and you'll be pulling tons more smallmouths than flounders. Add the likely xp differences back in, and the river is way ahead. Chubs have the same problem. Even the best fishermen are going to get perfects less consistently, and average players definitely won't get perfect on them nearly as much as all the town fish. It was a very different ballgame when higher fishing skill meant golds whether you got perfect or not.

Even later in the season and 6+ fishing skill, I'd still pick the river over the ocean. Most people will be able to get perfects on all 3 sunny day river fish very consistently. I've played a very long time, and am a pretty good at the fishing game (I catch catfish ~75% of the time at skill 3 and ~80-90% of the time at skill 4), but I still probably don't get more than 90% consistency on perfect catches for the lowest 3 ocean fish. At 6+, you're always getting gold or iridium, so the cost difference isn't quite a big... but the edge still goes to the river. In a realistic scenario, the average gold per catch is going to be extremely close, but the xp is still way ahead for the river (1 slip-up in the ocean is the difference between a 57.6xp smallmouth and 19xp anchovy).

The one exception to all this is if you're going strictly for fishing xp, eel fishing can potentially outpace river fishing by a decent margin. You can perfect catch eels (I get somewhere around 50-60%) for 91.2xp vs. 34xp for catfish or the rare (15% and can be a tricky combo) 74.8 catfish w/treasure chest. I've even gotten the 200xp perfect eel + treasure chest combo a few times.

 

Oh, and since it's a fishing thread so mostly on topic, I like to point out that I also go for the first backpack upgrade before the fiberglass rod. I generally pick up the fiberglass rod at ~10am on the 3rd. I potentially miss out on a few catches later on the 2nd, but you gain a *whole* lot more on the 3rd being able to hold on to many more treasure chest catches, and potentially ocean/town fish combinations if you want to ensure you get your eel that day as well for your bundle. Would be a whole lot easier if you could just buy the backpack upgrade on the 3rd, but oh well. Sometimes I get lucky enough to get the pack and rod upgrade on day 2, though.

 

I find buying the backpack upgrade before the fiberglass rodd pretty unnecessary. You can just bring a chest with you on day two and place it by the river and never worry about inventory space. This means that you can get the fibreglass rod on day 2, and it also saves you time on the third because you don´t need to go to Pierre. You don´t really need to have artifacts or gems in your inventory anyway, you can just pick them up from the chest later. I usually get the backpack upgrade on day 4, when I go to the mountain lake.

Also, if you have enough money to afford the fibreglass rod AND the backpack on day 2, wouldn´t you rather spend the money on extra bait and maybe trout soup for day 3? I mean, if you use a chest, the backpack is an unnecessary luxury, really, so you might as well spend the money on bait so you don't have to buy extra on day 3 and 4.

 

I suppose the chest would work, though only for fishing at 1 location. You'd need 2, or 100 wood, which is pretty hefty if you wanted to fish at 2 spots. And while I may try that route sometime, I usually rush the bridge with the wood and come out with ~250-500g more on day 2.

Trout soup is generally only necessary to make sure you're at skill 4, which I always hit by very early day 3 at the latest (*Totally* worth it through day 2, though). As long as you can catch catfish at 4, that is (I haven't had a problem with that for a long while, but definitely trickier for some). There's a minor benefit for using trout soup up until skill 5 (to push you to 6) to guarantee the gold/iridium fish... but the 250g difference for it, plus the hassle of getting that 250g early means I don't usually bother on day 3 unless I'm still at fishing 3. You'll still hit fishing 5 and possibly 6 by the end of day 3 even without bubbles as long as you're fairly accurate with your catches.

Anyway, I've just found over the last few playthroughs that I really like the versatility, and it has very little effect on my fishing level or cash flow to get the rod the morning of the 3rd. Plus it saves time on the 4th, which is when I do my massive planting to get farming 6 by the 14th (since I save my fish to sell on the 4th for the extra 25% if I didn't get some hefty bubbles on the 2nd, and there's usually quite a lot to carry to sell those and get other stuff done efficiently).

 

Buying the backpack day 2 is just insane. Two chests from chopping wood is a maximum of about 165E, but spending two grand on the backpack is the cost of fiberglass rod plus 40 bait, when you really don't need it until day 4. You are not going to earn over 2,000g from those 165E, or from having the backpack, to offset that, but for no real inconvenience, you can buy the backpack on day 4 with just half a dozen catfish sold at a 25% bonus

 

I'm a person that loves the backpack commodity, but I also create chests for this purpose, I try to make two chests in day 1 so I can have one on my farm and another in the lake, later I move that one in the lake for the mines as I really hate to explore the cavern without the backpack, I don't know how people can manage it even with the chest near the elevator.

 

I can go back to testing it with a chest, but I used to do the fiberglass rod first for quite a while, and just recently switched to the backpack first. Maybe it's the different route I took to complete those tasks, but I was getting better results that way than getting the fiberglass rod first. I think I'll try and move my farm chest over to use that, as the day 2 tide pool strategy has always been extremely useful for me. 250-500g is a significant amount worth of ocean fish on day 2 morning.

Also, I'm going to be restarting a game to try out the new wild bait mechanic, and rushing Linus' friendship. I figure if I can get him to 4 hearts by mid-spring, I can get a very significant boost to a couple mid-season rainy days. And while I assume that it's hard-coded that legendary fish can't be doubled with wild bait, I'd still like to have it by the time I usually catch Legend around the middle of the month... and you never know. Still, it's something I had never tried for the spring because just the bite rate boost wasn't enough to make me care. But now the prospect of double catching catfish along with the bite rate bonus is very appealing. Just have to cross my fingers for a Help Wanted for Linus to make it even faster.

 

Repairing the bridge to tide pools on day 2 seems extravagantly wasteful. Not only do you burn through about 500E to get the wood to do so, and a lot of time, but when you only get 250-500g (and sometimes nothing), you would have been financially far better off just flat out selling the 300 wood for a guaranteed 600g.

And unless you are always resetting day 1 for heaps of spring onions, you would have been even better off than that selling the food you found to power all that chopping.