I'd be extremely sad if....

You're right Attribule. The question is not directly about the difficulty level, but about the fact that devs will chose to set the game for the most players, or for their own sight.
Certainly not a particular point of view if they doesn't share it, except with difficulty options (which are the best way to find compromise)

other point of view : if you dont wanna play a game too easy, then don't play the game, thats how it should be.

I'm not arguing to make the game easier (I'm a hard core player), but your argument is just stupid and totally subjective.

I cant understand with what weird logic to give some attention to players who are less good will remove something to the ones who want challenge.

 

I'd be extremely sad if the game 'difficulty' stayed the way it is. Why? It doesn't appeal to the casual crowd who want to have a reasonable pacing throughout the game and just go explore and experience. It doesn't appeal to the real hardcore crowd who want to play games on ironman mode, where death is permanent and there is the risk of losing all. Right now about the only gameplay mechanic that helps manage risks consist of spamming dirt everywhere, ie 'scumming', which kind of defeats the point. It only seems to cater to a crowd who want a slow and tedious progress with little to no risks involved. As long as you can respawn infinite times with no penalites the game isn't really difficult, merely time consuming.

What I want is an 'easier' or smoother progression, with less instakills on both the monsters and players part, and an ironman mode where you do not respawn. Note that the ironman mode does not need to be officially implemented, it can be self-imposed.

 

I think there's two kinds of difficulty at play here: situational difficulty and statistical difficulty. Situational being what you're fighting at its core, enemy A.I., terrain, etc. All things that can more or less be combated through trial and error or preparation.

Then there's statistical difficulty, which introduces challenge via direct correlation between player and enemy statistics; gear and base stats. This is where I think the problem lies; there is very little situational difficulty, as those arguing how easy enemies and bosses are can attest. Most any enemy in the game can be combated fairly easily through a bit of terrain manipulation and careful movement. Instead, most if not all of the difficulty lies in statistics; gear and enemy level pretty much determine everything about how challenging the game is. Very seldom is there a balance between your power and your enemy's unless you very deliberately orchestrate such (such as always visiting only planets of your weapon and armor level). There's just too much difference in too few levels. Add to that that it's only possible to craft gear currently at five levels (four for the UFO as of latest patch) below every gatekeeper boss... Anytime where being up to date with a boss in terms of gear is completely reliant upon luck or time is a bad sign for any non-MMO.

There's also the issue of control: I played Terraria before Starbound, which I assume is true for many of you, and I'm sure anyone will agree that the controls are... loose at best in this game. Most of my deaths have been from being unable to land properly on a block as opposed to early monster gibbage. Being able to stop moving in one direction a bit more quickly would greatly help with that, and add some more skill-based challenge to fights.

One hit deaths are not cheap in and of themselves; how viable they are as a measure of challenge is greatly dependent on the situation. Going to Dark Souls as an example, let's assume you're playing for the first time through the game, when another player invades your world with high-level gear on a low-leveled character. Skill is not going to be an option; no matter how good you are, you're at best going to be their equal as getting high gear on a low-leveled character requires great familiarity with the game. As such, he is capable of one-shotting you, while you cannot possibly do the same outside of extreme circumstances. A bit of an extreme example, but not everyone enjoys such a broad gap between the chances of victory and defeat.

Whether or not one-hit deaths are workable also depends on the consequences of those deaths. Games like SHMUPs often have one-hit deaths, but you have multiple lives that drop you right back into the game a limited number of times; this turns one-shots into a challenge mechanic that works. The same can be said of another example brought up in the thread, Super Mario Bros.. There are checkpoints in most levels where you can restart from, and you lose little beyond a life when you die; the pace and structure of the game are conducive to quick comebacks and quick deaths. The same cannot be said for Starbound; as mentioned previously, much of the difficulty needs to be addressed currently by careful planning and tactics; a death therefore is a serious setback in terms of time and wasted effort, to say nothing of making a single mistake resulting in a one-shot death. Pixels aren't even on the board anymore due to the ease of getting more and the recent nerfs to early costs.

So, how do we make this better? There's many answers, some good, some bad, but all are technically viable. A difficulty slider, as mentioned many times, could be a good middle ground, but I think the best solution would be to reduce the discrepancy between levels of gear and monster threat level. This will prevent both monster and player damage from spiking too quickly, and allow players new to a tier to have a better chance of getting much-needed equipment. A lack of quick healing items is conducive to keeping some of the challenge, as while there's not a lot of difference between one hit and three, it's still quite easy to get caught up and repeatedly struck before you can recover sufficiently, while allowing players a chance to recover from a mistake and approach again. Another way to improve the issue is to introduce some sort of upgrade system to gear based on materials that could be randomly dropped by mobs, like monster hard plate. This would allow extra customization, still require one to work for the added power, and help balance against enemies who are beyond the craftable gear level for a given tier.

Of course, it goes without saying that improving the A.I. and adding more unique scripts for enemies would go a long way to shifting the balance away from a purely statistical challenge. I don't know whether or not any of this will be implemented, but I hope my two cents was at least contributing to the conversation without slighting people.

 

I like the current difficult level. It actualy makes you think and dodge and stuff. While in terraia you just spammed your left mouse button. With starbounds difficulty it's more challenge and fun... one thing can improve on is have unique drops for monsters... Eg if monster looks like it has skull for a head that protects its own head, maybe 10 % of the time it drops the skull head, it wouldn't be used for anything but for decorative purposes... nice to have though..

 

You know, there are even MMOs out there where you can do something in 5 Minutes. You can do something in 5 Minutes in Minecraft. Even in Diablo or PoE. In fact, lots of games are able to allow something in 5 Minutes. And Starbound is ALREADY one of them (5 minutes are good to go gather some coal or wood or make your base look a bit prettier). It just should not be "finishable" in 5 Minutes, which it is. But on the other end, its really buggy balancing when you have to worry about getting oneshot by stuff and then just go up one tier above them and are basically immune to everything the mob does to you now.

PS: i defeat the UFO. By Building like a little Bunker out of Obsidian which the ufo could not really brake. piece of cake by then (which is another very good example on how broken the balancing is if it wants you to find ways to completely eliminate all Boss Abilities).

 

Here's where you went wrong.

We're all gonna get old one day, and at that point for yourself you'll realize that the combination of aging reflexes and skill and the inability to take as much time as you used to out of your day to keep them razor sharp leaves you the one getting insulted by elitist trash.

This has nothing to do with "kids." Age isn't a sole criteria, there's many, many reasons why a given person isn't a "pro MLG gamer."

What this is about, is people being elitist numbskulls. But go ahead, help alienate more people from gaming.

 

I like the difficulty, I just can't stand some of the monster behaviour. The chargers are infuriating as they're nigh impossible to hit with a melee weapon without being hit yourself.

[edit] It's slightly more manageable with a two hander that has some reach. With a one handed weapon, problems arise.

 

I just think make the progression a little bit more stable. Still keep the boss hp as they are but allow me to get what I need in the Alpha stages etc. Currently in Beta and feel like I am at a block, not finding much in terms of new blueprints.

 

Too many of you people are playing this beta, barely out on its feet yet, as though it were a full game. The game's balance is going to shift a lot for the first two stages, so get used to it. Whinging at each other for having a different opinion isn't going to have much of an effect, anyways.

 

Everything fine for me atm.
Love the game and the diff.

Would be a shame if they nerve stuff, I like my games as i like my girlfriend's nipples... hard

 

It would be equally a shame if the game were limited to a small niche market because some people don't know how to give themselves a handicap if they want a challenge.

Honestly, the sentiment in this thread is terribly narrow-minded and petty. First of all, with generation being so random, your experience will vary greatly just based upon how you start out. Take my world for example, where there is no source of wood near spawn, the most common mob is hostile, and there is a toxic pool too wide to jump in either direction from the starting location. Also, it's a wet planet. Frequent rain meaning more warmth loss.

Secondly, take a look at your characters. There's a space for a difficulty setting, which (AFAIK) is not implemented yet. You want more of a challenge? Changing the difficulty setting is/will be an option. The base difficulty should be something that makes the game accessible to most players, without the need for them to mess with settings, so that you avoid driving people away through aggravation. Once your game gets a reputation for being unforgiving in its difficulty, it's really hard to woo in anyone but the most hardcore players. I'm sure that the folks at Chucklefish know this as well, since one of their other games is "Risk of Rain", which is exactly that type of game.

Finally, keep in mind that one of the final features that has been promised is exceptional modability. That means that, eventually, if the game's difficulty isn't to your liking, you will be able to do things to alter it. I'm sure that there will be some great "hardcore" mods out there when the time comes. However, once again, the base difficulty of the game must be designed to make the game playable for the entire market for the game, not just one small group of elitist players. Accessibility is essential to successfully grabbing a wider and loyal market base. Special challenges for those that desire them can always be addressed once the core of the game, the game that everyone can play, is finished.

 

I used the UFO as an example, the point was games should take time to complete, and should not cater to the people who only want to play the game for a day then go on to the next big game. I'm not saying there shouldn't be any quick activities, I'm saying people shouldn't expect to have the best gear and base in a day(slight exaggeration ofc.). You do understand the game is in testing phase right? The very first patch was a attempt to fix this particular boss and make it so you don't have to cheese it like that. I spent the time gathering materials for the UFO and by the time I got past it, the next set of mobs where on my level too.

 

You know I'm sorry that I have a differing opinon from yours about why DOOM is not a sandbox and why Starbound is. I'm also sorry I don't play Starbound like Dark Souls.

And I never said anything would "stop" Starbound from being a sandbox so putting words in my mouth and expecting me to reply to it seems strange. As far as I and anyone else who uses the term "cheap" it can mean anything so pretending everyone uses your definition of it seems close minded.

"Why do sandbox games deserve less respect and freedom?" I have no idea why you think others think that. "As soon as stress..." depends on the stress. I don't care how much hardc0res love being one shotted in the beta compared to everyone else their the only ones having fun.

One of the devs even said the game is in need of balancing and is a bit too hard right now.

My point that DOOM, Contra and I suppose now that you mention it Mario are not Sandboxes. Dark Souls could be considered a Sandbox I suppose. But then again you would compare it to a sandpit or something.

I'm not going to debate about the storage issue anymore. Its my opinion and its obvious we wont come to a resolve about this. Losing 30% of your pixels might start being okay when the game is balanced but right now being one shotted or being the victim of absurd fall damage does not make it feel fair.

I just woke up so maybe I missed some things to reply to.

 

You haven't comprehended my post at all. My point was that games of many different genres can still have similar punishments for death, which is significant lost progress. Why should sandbox games suddenly do things differently? Is there something in the definition of sandbox that says it won't cause the player to lose much progress upon death?

Also, I never said that the game wasn't too hard or that monsters 1shotting you was a good thing. You can't just assume "he want the game to be harder in this regard so he must want the game to be harder in this unrelated aspect too." You're the second person to imply this, so good job, I guess...

 

And my point is that different genres can have different death penalties that make sense in their case. Anyways now with the update that reduces crafting costs (too much in my opinion) I think that the death penalty is okay and should be returned to its previous amount.

In FPS games death means you restart at a checkpoint or the whole mission. Same goes for the other respective genres. In sandbox games you simply respawn with a penalty applied like losing all your items or something else. If the penalty was restarting the whole game with nothing and all your structures demolished in sandbox games then there would a problem (unless its a roguelike).

And the vocal minority on this forum seems to think that the harder the game is the better. So I assumed the same goes for you.

 

I'm sick of elitists ruining games by being VERY vocal minorities...

Guys, not everyone has the same skill level. Not everyone enjoys the same things. Everyone plays differently.

You can't FORCE people to play your way. That'll just kill the game.

Get over your superiority complex, because that's just going to ruin things.

Difficulty settings would be the best thing for Starbound. HOWEVER, gameplay-effecting items should NOT be locked out due to difficulty levels. If there are to be rewards for people who play higher difficulties, then they should be purely cosmetic.

 

And I was saying that being able to store pixels would make less sense than not being able to. Anyway, if you agree that it's ok now that the items are easier to obtain, this argument is closed as there's nothing left in the discussion.

Also, I think that the previous "big two" Sandbox games similar to this are incredibly unpolished in many regards and shouldn't be followed so closely, but meh.

No, but the developers can. How can these "elitists" ruin the game, anyway? Is your experience really going to be dulled because someone said "LOL I got t3h m4d skills u shit noobz" while playing the game?

 

They cant ruin the game but its irritating how in every discussion about the difficulty they go like "Not hrd nub "Play the gam rite" "you all suk for dien"

But anyways I trust the developers will do what is right.

 

I feel the difficulty is pretty on par. I think a few things could be done to make it a smoother introduction to the game. You don't want to drive off new players and gamers because they can't get through the initial content in the game.

Reducing the pixel costs of early game stuff and padding the tutorial quests will help this a ton. Not drastic changes, but good ones to get people up and running and doing cool stuff earlier. I like challenging games. I don't like frustrating games.

 

THIS this is the right way of thinking.