Cask's are almost useless

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Obesius, Jan 8, 2017.

  1. Obesius

    Obesius Big Damn Hero

    So the only real use for Cask's is to increase the gift value, since the Gold per Day is bigger for the starting product.
    Only use i can see in gold is the last Fall harvest, since you can Age the product's during Winter.

    Really think it should get a buff on the value.
     
    • Minimanta

      Minimanta Spaceman Spiff

      Yeah, either a buff in value or cut the time down. I don't bother with the casks, it's just not worth the trouble in my opinion.
       
      • ShneekeyTheLost

        ShneekeyTheLost Black Hole Surfer

        My problem isn't necessarily that it takes forever to age, it is that there isn't enough room to do it in the volume required to make it worth my time. You may ONLY put casks in the Cellar, which is very strictly limited in space. You can only cask a tiny fraction of even your output from your Greenhouse, much less anything else.
         
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        • Ambaaargh

          Ambaaargh Hard-To-Destroy Reptile

          I find them fun, but I admit I don't really cask for profit since there's not really anything I can't buy at this point in my main game. I cask mostly for my own personal amusement and the idea of eventually getting 999 iridium cheeses, starfruit wine, beer, mead, etc for my own personal collection appeals to me. And gives me something to slowly build up while I continue to make crazy money on the side. So for me its just this quality cherry to put ontop of my sundae rather than a major profit booster.
           
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          • Obesius

            Obesius Big Damn Hero

            It's useful for gift's, for example in case you want to befriend Pam (Not sure why you want that) you can give her Iridium Pale Ale.


            Yeah my Cellar is a Storage, used Cask's once, then i noticed i was losing money.


            The thing is that CA wants to have a free meta, so everyone can try new stuff, we are going to probably see some buffs on the price.


            Right now it's like 14 days to get a 2x boost, maybe having it like 3x with less days will make it slight better.
             
            • Zidane471

              Zidane471 Industrial Terraformer

              Gotta wonder, how can you lose money on an item you would have sold anyway but for less money? For me, in one year I have 16 shipments of wine. 14 are sold straight the other 2 are aged. Each is a shipment of 120. I would like to know how I'm losing money this way.
               
              • Obesius

                Obesius Big Damn Hero

                (GpD = Gold per Day)
                Grape: 8 GpD
                Grape (Normal Wine): 19 GpD
                Grape (Iridium Wine): 10 GpD

                You get more money, but you take more time, so you are "losing" money, investing into Cask's and investing your time on less profit.
                 
                • ShneekeyTheLost

                  ShneekeyTheLost Black Hole Surfer

                  You're operating under a fallacy of false comparison.

                  Your cask is ON TOP OF rather than instead of your regular production. Let me see if I can explain.

                  You're comparing the per-day yield of grapes in a Keg and grapes in a Cask. However, using a Cask does not prevent you from also using a Keg. So out of that grape, you aren't losing any money, you're just spending more time in the cask to make it worth more while your other grapes are cycling through your kegs as normal.

                  The problem with your 'gold per day' calculation is that if you take it a step further, Preserves go from 80 to 210 in two days, or ~65 GpD. And if you just sell it straight... well, you get ERROR: DIVIDE BY ZERO GpD, which is where the system breaks down.

                  It's a matter of profit-per-transaction rather than how fast it yields, in most cases.
                   
                    ari462 likes this.
                  • Obesius

                    Obesius Big Damn Hero

                    Yeah but when i said investing in Cask's is rather the place they are taking, you have an extra room under the house, that won't take any area from your farm "normal area"
                    you can fill the thing with Keg's and increase the profit

                    The Preserves Jar Work's like this:
                    Fruit Value * 2 + 50 (4000m ~3 Days)

                    So for example:

                    Grape: 8 GpD
                    Grape Jelly: 16,5 GpD

                    Starfruit: 57 GpD
                    Starfruit Jelly: 96 GpD

                    (Normal Quallity)
                     
                    • ShneekeyTheLost

                      ShneekeyTheLost Black Hole Surfer

                      With Sheds available, space is not a significant constraint.
                       
                      • Ambaaargh

                        Ambaaargh Hard-To-Destroy Reptile

                        Between sheds and barns, I admit I've never had much of a space issue. If anything I find time and my own attention span the biggest hindrances to profits I have. :rofl:
                         
                        • Zidane471

                          Zidane471 Industrial Terraformer

                          Had a feeling that is what you meant, Shneekey got here first though.

                          With sheds or barns I would be hard pressed to run out of space for kegs. As it is, 120 Starfruit wine processed weekly over the course of the year is 5,280,000g. That's a single shipment. I can easily double or triple that and not break a sweat. I know the golden clock it 10 million but, there simply is no purpose in that kind of money. (Other than pure giggles.)

                          CA just went through and "balanced" a single player game to make sure players don't feel they have to use outlying crops. Including Starfruit which dropped from 800g to 750g and Ancient Fruit from 750g all the way down to 550g. From what I can tell casks are a small way to return some of the lost profits to all the players making a fortune off wine at the cost of being patient. (All those farms that were set up before 1.1 took a huge hit that day.) But, wine with or without the balancing is incredibly valuable, especially thanks to the artisan perk. (Which also saw an adjustment.)

                          My point is, Casks only improve the value of the products put inside. If that is too much work or waiting, don't bother with them. But, placing anywhere (Which doesn't make sense due to real aging requiring cool dark places. Summer sheds and barns, let alone outside are definitely neither.) or speeding up production completely undermines the recent balance changes. That and you also have to realize that it is one thing to complain about the already super valuable wine being slow to age. (As it is in real life.) But, a change to speed will effect all items that are placed inside. Cut it in half to make aging wine a "reasonable" 1 season and cheeses now go from normal to iridium in one week. (That doesn't even factor that cheese can come out of the cheese maker as gold. It would be 4 days or so for Iridium.) On top of that beer and mead would take a mere two weeks to double in value. Yes, by the numbers wine is the most valuable use for the casks, but not everyone plays that way and CA went out of his way to reduce the outlying money makers so that people don't feel forced to play the "optimal way." Take out this factor and the balances were completely unnecessary and perhaps even uncalled for. (Seriously, what was the point in making wine less valuable if it is just going to get a free x2 bonus from casks. Its the restriction to quantity that prevents this from being a straight buff to the already OP wine after the update.)
                           
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                          • Obesius

                            Obesius Big Damn Hero

                            @ShneekeyTheLost @Ambaaargh @Zidane
                            What i usually do is break all buildings during winter on one year or another, then i use 100%~ of the terrain on mega farming
                            The whole year of shipping usually gets me free from having to do new stuff for some time, i have money for trying new stuff and rebuild shed's.
                             
                            • GreenWombat

                              GreenWombat Scruffy Nerf-Herder

                              nvm
                               
                                Last edited: Jan 9, 2017
                              • ShneekeyTheLost

                                ShneekeyTheLost Black Hole Surfer

                                Then you're bringing in roughly 25 million by the end of the second year, and you have no need for the pittance which casks might be able to offer on top of that.
                                 
                                • bobucles

                                  bobucles Scruffy Nerf-Herder

                                  There is probably something to be said for packing more kegs in your basement. But when it comes to profit per EFFORT casks win hands down.

                                  Go to your basement twice a year for an extra few hundred k? Yes please.

                                  Besides if you are sorely desperate for keg space, it's time to use some of that land away from the farm...
                                   
                                  • ShneekeyTheLost

                                    ShneekeyTheLost Black Hole Surfer

                                    No one walks down the path north of your farm that connects up near Robin's, and no one goes into the highway tunnel where the battery pack goes either. Both places can be used to place several hundred kegs.
                                     
                                    • Obesius

                                      Obesius Big Damn Hero

                                      The thing is that it takes around 28 days to get Iridium, this is 2 full basement in one year (since you need the crops to grow + make the wine + 28 days) and its 189 cask's per basement
                                      Put in mind that i will be getting the entire farm full of crops, i'm already using free spaces out of the farm to the kegs.
                                      Using casks will only make my work harder since i will have to go out "to the beach" to get my wine!

                                      Also to add more info to the topic:
                                      Jelly is the best option for cheaper products, while the wine/juice is the best option for more valuable products.
                                       
                                      • Jayfeather980

                                        Jayfeather980 Subatomic Cosmonaut

                                        I don't understand how it is a loss. I have typically already reloaded all my kegs with new crops to turn into wine before I load the wine into the casks. It is silly though considering only about 1/3 to 1/4 of a weekly wine harvest can actually be placed in the casks. Currently my Green House produces more fruit than I can make wine and jelly out of.

                                        I have my Basement CRAMMED with casks so the biggest effort is having to pickaxe so many casks to get to the iridium wine without hitting the cask before removing the wine (Doing this crashes to the desktop.) And managing all my loose casks while in the dismantling and reassembling the cask setup. Needless to say I tend to procrastinate doing this as it can take the better part of a day in game. In IRL time, wine is about the only thing I would even bother with, even then it is easier to just ship it as is.
                                         
                                        • ari462

                                          ari462 Subatomic Cosmonaut

                                          This.

                                          I think the usefulness of casks depends on the scale of your farm. For example, I'm making my farm only part ancient fruit and part decoration. This means I won't have as much produce so I won't need as many kegs. This means I won't need that cellar space for other stuff, so I can increase the wine valley more with kegs. Now let's say my farm was completely packed with fruit, no decorations all production. If this were the case, then the casks would not be as useful because there is a surplus of fruit to make into wine so the celler space can be used for kegs to make more wine rather than aging it.

                                          It really all just depends on how much produce you are using for whether casks are worth it or not

                                          Oh also, on top of what I said, casks are useful during winter EVEN if you have a huge maxed out farm. During winter you have less fruit to put into kegs (just greenhouse fruit) so during this season replacing some kegs with casks is useful because you won't have enough kegs to fill up AND you'll have extra room from the dead crops.
                                           
                                            Last edited: Jan 9, 2017

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