Modding Discussion Avali 1.0 Reboot Discussion

Discussion in 'Starbound Modding' started by RyuujinZERO, Aug 11, 2016.

  1. Roland Weiss

    Roland Weiss Cosmos Killer

    Does he have the whip? And the hat?
     
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  2. Sock of Retribution

    Sock of Retribution Void-Bound Voyager

    Jiro feels that he wouldn't look too good in a fedora, but he's still looking for a suitable bullwhip. He already has a man pouch which is close enough to his idol's for him to brag about it. He also rather randomly quotes Indy enough for other avali to think he's lost a couple marbles; to be truthful, Jiro is quite quirky.
     
  3. YellowDemonHurlr

    YellowDemonHurlr Phantasmal Quasar

    Yeah, I figure the same.
     
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  4. YellowDemonHurlr

    YellowDemonHurlr Phantasmal Quasar

    Okay, double post but nobody will be notified if I just edit my old post. Why have I never seen an avali atl-atl/spear throwing lever? Since they're too stubby to use bows, this seems like the next best thing for cavevali/traditional hunting enthusiasts.
     
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  5. Roland Weiss

    Roland Weiss Cosmos Killer

    Oversight, I imagine. And they already have guns, so they might've fallen by the wayside.
     
  6. Scival

    Scival Master Astronaut

    If you want to pretend you're not doubleposting, edit your old post, copy the contents, then delete it, and post it again with whatever you want to add on to it and people will still be notified.
     
  7. Sock of Retribution

    Sock of Retribution Void-Bound Voyager

    Simply because they apparently never developed them before the benefactors came, and now it's just a waste of time. The only weapon that'd be seen as traditional to the avali is the spear.
     
  8. YellowDemonHurlr

    YellowDemonHurlr Phantasmal Quasar

    Well the atl-atl is a natural evolution of the spear thrower, aspecially for a species like the avali which is, again, quite stubby. We invented it 15 - 20,000 years ago, it's no great leap to expect the avali to have done the same.
     
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  9. DraikNova

    DraikNova Phantasmal Quasar

    Yeah. And even on earth, there are a variety of similar devices, like the woomera, so it's not like inventing spear throwing devices is a particularly limited field.
     
  10. Sock of Retribution

    Sock of Retribution Void-Bound Voyager

    I guess it would make sense for the avali to develop the atlatl without outside assistance, but there's also the issue of what material it would be built with. Due to the very simple nature of the tool, it could likely be carved out of ice or even nakati bark, so that probably wouldn't be an issue.

    So yeah, it's really entirely possible they could have developed it, but I think the weapon is just so overlooked that allowing the avali to canonically use it as a traditional weapon wouldn't have that much purpose with guns around.
     
  11. YellowDemonHurlr

    YellowDemonHurlr Phantasmal Quasar

    Ice seems fragile, but bone is a common material historically.

    Well you could say the same thing about bows, which are in Starbound by default. This is really why I brought this up, because all the races have a hunting weapon except the hunter avali. And lore-wise, even though we have advanced firearms in this day and age, there are still people who like to hunt with muskets, bows, etc.
     
  12. Sock of Retribution

    Sock of Retribution Void-Bound Voyager

    Hunting weapons for each race? I'm not really sure I know what you're talking about, do you mean unique hunting weapons for each race? Cause I can't think of any. And the avali have their own bows, so they're not deprived of olden hunting weapons.

    Calcium's an element, no reason it wouldn't be common with the presence of something like kiri milk. It shouldn't be especially toxic to any Avalonian organism, either.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2017
  13. DraikNova

    DraikNova Phantasmal Quasar

    I'd imagine that two of the main uses of atlatls in modern Avali society would be sport and practicing hand-eye coordination, which would be a useful skill for a species that, if I'm interpreting what's been said before correctly, has a relatively slow nervous system.
     
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  14. hypergen8

    hypergen8 Big Damn Hero

    On the topic of this subject, i have actually made Atlatls before, they are a powerful weapon that the Avali would be using for hunting in their modern time, because if you think about it guns aren't really a good hunting method. A. they make TONS of noise, even the avali's rail guns would be loud enough to scare wildlife, Atlatls on the other hand are silent if you know how to use them, and if you are precise you can kill and animal instantly, making almost no noise. B. Their rail guns would need energy cells and probably coolant to keep them running, that stuff doesn't exactly grow on trees, which makes them pretty bad for some packs who aren't tasked with setting up somewhere. C. Ammo, guns need ammo, you cant exactly make bullets by banging two rocks together, you need to cast it, which needs a more advanced setup. Atlatls on the other hand don't need any special tools to make ammo, and you can reuse it many times before needed replacement, and Atlatls aren't that heavy, which for the Avali who are a pretty lightweight race, would be great. All and all i think Atlatls are a better option then rail guns for hunting.
     
  15. Sock of Retribution

    Sock of Retribution Void-Bound Voyager

    That's true, but guns are already on the market in large numbers, they're just more powerful, and the increased cost isn't really significant when you have proper facilities, so atlatls aren't the clear winner. It depends on the pack/tribe's preference and circumstances, I think. Still, atlatls are probably more efficient for hunting game.
     
  16. DraikNova

    DraikNova Phantasmal Quasar

    Well, you could probably make guns that fire electromagnetic plasma using railgun technology. So bullets wouldn't necessarily be an issue for Avali hunters. As for energy, once you have space travel, I imagine your energy generation and battery technology is probably pretty good, enough that you could probably recharge your gun's batteries on the go without too much trouble (if avali coated their tents with solar cells, assuming modern efficiency, they'd get about one railgun shot per square meter per five hours, assuming a railgun that is probably overkill for hunting (3.6 megajoules per shot; the most powerful railgun fired on earth used 33 megajoules per shot)). As for noise, even hunters today use bullets, and you know why? Because bullets mean you stand a good chance of fatally wounding your target with the first shot. It doesn't matter if noise would scare your prey if that prey is dead by the time that noise is made.
     
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  17. Scival

    Scival Master Astronaut

    Avali don't "cast" ammo. They have nanolathes. Silly goose!
    But they probably need to have a targetting computer in their helmet to hit anything with a gun, so I'd imagine traditional hunters would probably use spears.
     
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  18. Fevix

    Fevix Ketchup Robot

    Each and every one of you are forgetting two key aspects here:

    Avalonian prey creatures are typically described as "Behemoths". They're massive things that most predators prefer to just carve a chunk out of rather than kill outright (That is, if it's even POSSIBLE for them to kill such giants). The behemoths survive simply because nothing can do much damage to them. Think Brontosaurus and you have what could be considered a baby Behemoth.

    On top of that, throwing weapons need sharp eyesight, which the avali lack. The only way for them to compensate would be to add targeting mechanisms to the thrown part and then you're back to Hypergen's points where it becomes prohibitively expensive for a pack that has to go 'off the grid' for whatever reason.
     
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  19. Sock of Retribution

    Sock of Retribution Void-Bound Voyager

    Yes, I've heard of behemoths, but I didn't think they were that extreme. Where did you get the info on their approximate size? The wiki and Ryuu's lore dump is all that the vast majority of the Avali community have at our disposal, and even together that's rather limited. Outside of those two it's just speculation.

    As for the eyesight problem, there's always augments. Necessity of frontier 'vali leads me to believe that eye augments would be pretty widespread, too.

    And since you're here, Fevix, we might as well talk about Avali development. I think you guys have noticed that Ryuujin has been away from the community for months now, which has me worried but also irritated. If he resorts to spending his free time on Wargrind, he should at least let others work on the mod under development guidelines he sets up.

    So that kinda means the ball is on your court for now, Triage team. It's not imperative that new content be added for the avali, but as it stands the community is kinda in the dark since neither you guys nor Ryuujin have updated for some time. I, at least, can think of many things to add to Triage that can just be carried over to the reboot. I understand the lengths all of you have went through, and this takes time and effort, but if you've kept this up until recently and then just drop the horse, then people are going to be disappointed. I honestly feel like I'm a squeaky wheel, but I feel even more like this needs to be said and no one else is willing to come out to say it.

    You could start by helping out TheOnlyRen with his endeavor of adding unique avali PC dialogue and object descriptions: I think getting the team in on that effort would be a really good use of resources, and would add something meaningful to the mod.
     
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  20. Fevix

    Fevix Ketchup Robot

    I've slowly been getting back into the modding mindset for a while, and it would be much better to contact me over Discord about this.

    I'm probably going to work on the issues that have been reported to the Github first of all, get those cleared away, while looking around to see who's still active from the old team.
     
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