An emotional thread about your disappointments in Starbound

Hi, Sirnak here writing on the forums for the first time in quite some time because, like many people, I like expressing myself from time to time.

I'm well aware of the kind of complaints Starbound's development process keeps getting regularly and even in the first page of the discussion section I've seen at least 3 threads of different backers "complaining" or criticizing the development of the game. Nothing new here though, I've been following Starbound since the first few days this website appeared and for at least the last two years Chucklefish had to deal with a never ending stream of complaints of different kinds. The objective of this thread is to state your own personal disappointment in Starbound, specifically its development process, so that Chucklefish could take note of all our different disappointments. I invite everybody to speak frankly about their disappoinments on the development progress with full respect for Chucklefish and their team in the hope that all the comments this thread could eventuelly handle would allow Chucklefish to learn what has hurt the Starbound community spirit the most because, at this point, I believe it is a fact that the community spirit around the game, while still quite present, isn't what it used to be. Complaints keep popping around all the time, even me I keep seeing them even though I don't lurk around here as much as I used too a couple of years ago. So please everyone, use this thread as a constructive mean or as a respectul emotional tool to express yourself. I don't claim this thread to be original or anything, but it's still the one I created. May it reach someone positively out there. Then again, I guess it's nothing far from the usual "I keep complaining so listen to me" thread. But I do hope this one here could be a little more constructive for everyone.

At any rate, my turn first.

My biggest disappointment with Starbound is, nothing new here, its ridiculous development time. I believe Chucklefish aimed far too high with this game and made the project public way too soon. The result is now getting more and more disastrous on people like me who've been around for years, never getting the game the wanted at first. I personally never wanted a crop system, a quest system, a creature generator system, a food system or many other things the team keeps adding to the game. Those were never meant to be in the project that was first presented to us 3 years ago (if not more). I'm aware that the team always aimed at adding everything they liked from different video games to Starbound in order to make their "dream game", it was always what Starbound was about, but the development process of a game shouldn't be like that. Real objectives are necessary in order to keep a somewhat reliable finish date and keeping wanting to add more just makes the project feel always less and less finished. I believe that's what disappointed me the most with Chucklefish.

The lack of clear line, the desire to always keep pushing new things and systems in the game. In its own way, it IS a good thing. But I feel like Chucklefish pushed that way too far. I've kept reading development posts about functions that I never wanted in the game (and that were never talked about either). Like musical instruments, agriculture, cooking, quests, tiered planets, character progression, monster part randomizer... I'm well aware that many of these systems are well liked by many players, that is not the point of my disappointment. My disappointment comes from the fact that more and more keeps getting added while nothing was ever finished in the first place, making everyhting feel like a giant mess of a game with far too much stuff compressed into Starbound. A "dream game" shouldn't be about adding every kind of game and mashing it together. For that reason, I've kinda lost hope in Tiy and Chucklefish. Even recently Tiy has tweeted: "Soooo much new stuff in Starbound, I should do a video to explain some of it." But Tiy, I love you guy, you have an awesome personality and all, but I do believe you've strayed somewhere. A game should have clear boundaries. Starbound had some at first, but now it clearly hasn't. Then again, maybe it was what you always aimed at with Starbound, to be bounded by nothing but the stars, to keep working on a project that keeps getting wider and wider, never reaching the impossible goal right there in the sky.

But that wasn't why I came here at first. I wanted a full, complete experience. Not a feeling that nothing will never be finished, always improving. I don't believe that's what a video game should be either. Your team is awesome and I love pretty much every single game Chucklefish has helped this far, I always have full confidence in the skills of your team, but for this very reason I'm not much interested into Starbound at all anymore. I'm way more interested into seeing what you guys will do with the pirate game you've been teasing. I want to see a Chucklefish game complete, not a neverending game software that keeps trying to mash more stuff into itself all the time. Please Chucklefish, I really want you to make a full game that is not drowning in a pool of functions most of us will never even want to touch.

I love you guys and I'm sorry if I hurt anyone, but I really had to express myself after all these years after all the hope I've had in this project.

 

This is understandable. I just hope this thread doesn't get locked.

 

First of all, respect for your patience man...wow I'm only into this game for like....8-9 months and I've already lose my patience with this game. In fact, the developing time of it. The whole thing about this game is like this: We have an awesome ideea about this game, back us with your money, and people did, and then....well....
They are constantly changing things. This hole nightly thing is practically a set up. They somehow managed to convince people that is like a new stable.
Every time you see somebody asking about the stable/unstable beeing updated they shout: Check out the nightlys!!! In fact, there's nothing there. There is not a sustainable game that we can play and report bugs and crashes. The people that are playing the nightlys have no opinion in the making of this game. As it should be. The devs should respect the voice of the community because they suported them with their money. If Chucklefish allready have the money to develop this game by themselfs then we would not have the right to express ourselfs. We want a stable/unstable update because we have this right? Get it?!
I repeat myself but: I want this game to succeed, because it has that little extra among other games.

 

It won't be so long as people stay chill, be respectful, and refrain from breaking rules.

 

Well, if i put aside problem with updates, which is already being discussed to death and nothing, but those red "Being a jerk" raccoons will come out of it, my main problem is that, the thing which would be out as "Starbound 1.0" won't be Starbound. At all. It probably would be a good game, Nice addition to Terrarias family and all, but it would be so different from original concept that i would not be able to call it Starbound. "Terraria in space", yes, but not Starbound. And, no, i'm not being sarcastic or trying accuse CF of plagiarism or something. "Terraria in space" is nice, it surely would have a lot of things Terraria didn't have and would be nice to play, but in the end i want Starbounds original concept.
Ofc, it normal for a game to change while in development, but not only those changes are simply too much, major changes like this are not very fair for a lot of ppl who pre-ordered SB based on original list of features, especially if game were sold under premise of being "almost ready". No one could expect such major changes in "almost completed game".

Sorry, but you're not being fair. Huge number of ppl bought SB under different circumstances, without any mention of EA. I know that EA means, and if i bought SB as EA project i'd never rant about it so much.

 

I can "dig" that. After all that was the coal that powered the hype train.

 

I'd say it was something what ppl who yet to know details about SB would say. Like: "I heard there is a game called Starbound and it's like Terraria in Space with great art!". But as soon one check the details it were pretty obvious they are very different with SB being less combat-focused and more gameplay-deep.And Tiy himself said a lot of times about SB not being "Terraria in space". And i'm sure he said that, not because of Copyright issues, if any were possible present, but because Starbound were supposed to be really different.

 

I appreciate your reply, howewer the aim of this thread is not to ask for answers (since obviously there are plenty and in the last years I've read many answers from the dev team explaining why the development took so long), but to share disappointments (in the most respectful possible way) within the community in hope the development team may get a glimpse of how we feel from our side of the screen. I do hope it could eventually help Starbound's development goal at some point, if not it could always have some use for Chucklefish's future projects I guess, at the very least in the PR department. Actually your reply makes me believe that you unfortunately didn't read all my post or at least didn't fully understand what I was trying to say since your last sentences are exactly the ultimate concretisation of all my concerns if not more when you say: "The fact that you feel disappointed about this is not something we can do much about. We have to focus on making the game the best it can be, and a game that everyone wants to play - not a game catered to one person's tastes."

I'm unsure of such a development goal, to make a game that everyone wants to play. Exactly my entire personal disappointment is the fact that Chucklefish had to keep adding more systems and functions in the game without ever having "boundaries" as to when to stop. I'm very sorry if you read my post as simply another "I want this game for my taste" kind of post, but to me your reply ultimately proves that all my worries about Starbound are funded and that my personal disappointment about a never ending development cycle in hope to insert as many systems as possible is all but true.

Still, that's just me. I'm curious as to see what everyone has to say and what disappointments they may feel since not everybody would feel the same way as me, obviously. I don't pretend to possess the ultimate truth about game-making. I have but an humble, single point of view.

 

Honestly, the only thing I have to complain about is how the devs shot for the moon and missed by a fair bit. That just created a bunch of backlash, but I've taken up the stance of 'give them time' because they're actually pulling this off little by little, bit by bit. Sure, there's that 'drop ores on death' thing that's cracked the fanbase in (seemingly) half and unpopular enough to warrant the creation of mods to disable it, but most of the rest has been nothing but positive. Reworking the Matter Manipulator so it's not a throwaway tool was a welcome change and answered how we were going to move liquids, the new cave generation system has created an even less painful experience than Terraria's (and that's saying something), the crop system being reworked was a beautiful thing (persistent plants) whose only fault is perhaps resulting in having excess seeds that aren't needed once you're established. And even then there's the possibility that those excess seeds could at least be sold, traded, or turned in for quest rewards. Making it so ocean worlds can /finally/ begin to be implemented properly is another thing I'm excited for, because building underwater bases is slick and easy even compared to Terraria, and infinitely easier than in Minecraft. It's just, there's so much to look forward to now and believe it or not it's trickling in at a fairly steady pace. Sure, constantly resetting characters and universes is a pain, but it's a beta.

 

I just wish they would pull the trigger, and not worry about losing past characters. It's beta... don't waste time trying to hold on to old/bad code. Just implement it, grind it up, and finish making that sausage! It still needs cooked....

 

I would like to point out that Supernorn has a point. If no one wants any examples, from someone working on the game, of how their concerns are being addressed or addressed differently. Or why they aren't being addressed, then this thread should honestly be locked. The devs are people too and bashing never helped anyone. It surprises me that people can be so disappointed when devs are far and above more interactive than say Minecraft devs. I hope that this thread is actually constructive for the community rather than destructive and the people take Supernorn or any other dev who may decided to comment on this thread fairly and seriously, this can be a helpful situation that will maybe restore some good will. But, if people come to this thread looking to spew venom and hate........then definitely only more of the same fracturing that as happened will continue.

 

Well we all deal with things differently. I personally am fine and just play other games, but others get more effected by things like this.

 

The kangaroo is right. Though, I wonder if those options will manifest them self after more of the core game is done, and difficulty is actually implemented with more options.

 

I apologize if I made it sound as if your answer wasn't welcomed, what I meant to say by saying that the point of this thread was "not for answers" was in the pespective that I don't consider my own personal disappointment to be absolute for the whole community. And, well, devs cannot be asked to answer for every bigger or smaller disappointment that could pop up in this thread since it could quickly add up, every player potentially having his/her own little or big disappointment.

I sincerely did appreciate your reply though, but I was indeed shocked by your mention that the team was aiming to please everyone with Starbound. From my perspective, such an objective (as awesome as it is) is so grand that it seems to me that at the end of the line it does result in some kind of "throwing systems for the sake of it" as you say, because it will always be impossible to please every type of player at the end of the day if not after a terrific amount of work that would never end (which Starbound sounds more and more about). I'm well aware that Chucklefish most likely has a development plan and objectives to reach, I didn't want to suggest that everything was simply done for the hell of it. You guys are professional and I trust every single member of Chucklefish. My disappointment was not about that. My disappointment was about a development process that kept expanding for 3 years after keeping adding new and improved systems or system ideas one after the other while many of the new ones (by "new", I mean less than 2 years ago) had nothing to do with what the initial core fanbase expected from the game. Some likely were happy with musical instruments and agriculture, among other things. I was not. My disappointment is personal because Starbound started heading in directions that had nothing to do with what first made me interested in the game. And worst than that, I have the feeling that your team objective to please everyone just made the game lag behing in term of release date, forcing Chucklefish to scrap many systems and to rewrite them entirely in order to make them work with older systems, among other problems showing up along the way with the need to keep inserting new systems. That's my own personal disappointment and unfortunately no reason you can share with me can erase my disappointment even though you can indeed help me understand your situation and perspective, which I indeed welcome you to do. That's also why I said this thread was "not for answers" since it's impossible to erase many of the disappointments felt by people unless they would be small gameplay tweaks.

I appreciate your replies though as they prove (I never doubted it though) that you indeed really have your community at heart. Unfortunately, the one thing that worries me is ironically the fact that Chucklefish so much wants to please its community that it's trying to please everyone, which is a very, very dangerous goal from my perspective. Most games that wanted to please everyone are hardly anything more than average games. Resident Evil 6, I'm looking at you... But yeah, that's only me. I hope you guys prove me wrong, that would be really awesome and the one time in my life I would enjoy every bit of being wrong.

Anyway, thanks a lot Supernorn.

 

Really the only thing that was disappointing to me was that I was not able put down money on it earlier, and had to wait for a steam release. The reason I say this is due to my own preferences and lack there of means. So being able to buy a card to put into an account per say was a lot easier than a bank upkeep that I at the moment can not afford.

I basically did and still am on the same notion that I put down money to see a game develop into what they, the devs, have put forth in their mind, goals, and the like. Even if not all is actually public, it doesn't have to be, just on a "need to know" basis. It is how I look at thinks.

Sure I might not like this or that, but also I have not seen the final product so in a way I wouldn't have a full judgement per say whether I would like as a whole or not. So I await patiently. that is something I guess I have a lot more than the average person, is patience. Since I am basically an 80s kid, I have seen quite a bit of the industry grow and change. Although I was born a bit before that. Still my patience is something I managed to learn over the years, and also learn to look at things as a whole; with as many resources available that I can access within reason.

I see quite a bit of development of a usual game. Every game that I have ever liked has gone through the same very thing; just some more public than others. Of course before there wasn't really an early access program, it was a cart or disk of some kind. One done it was on the shelf to see whether it would make sales or not. At least now people can work together in this new program, and so far it looks to me they are listening.

Like someone else put it, just because you don't see it now, does not mean something will not be done with it at a later date. I am sure not all things can be delivered, and not everybody will be fond of the end result, but to aim for everybody is a good notion. All this means to me is that if the mass majority does like it then I would call it a success. I am not a perfectionist, but tend to look at things for what they are, or do my best trying to see all sides.

Most of this is my viewpoint granted, as I am the one writing. I take usually a neutral stance on things for the most part, as I analytically do my best seeing and doing what I mentioned above. Now I think I am starting to in a way repeat myself too many times in the same post, so I'll cut it off there before I continue that nasty habit of mine. Cheers to the insight and hope i will see what the finished product will be in the end, or well when at least 1.0 does hit. That can and will take time.