Important BETA RELEASE DISCUSSION - DECEMBER 4TH (*ALL* beta discussion goes here. Other threads deleted)

haha, rlx dude, im not a grammar nazi, when i say people are crossing the line is not because they complain, it's because i see people complaining about the devs like if they were sitting back looking at the pre-orders an thinking: "man, im going to relax while you preorder a game that im not even putting any efforts in".

One thing i hate is false accusations and SOMETIMES it happens here, that's what i call crossing the line.

Like that.

 

I see what you mean, welp, freedom of speech, can't help with that can we.
There is a scale, like such > (Full Ret*** Fanboy) - (Fanboy) - (Fan) - (Bystander) - (Disappointed) - (More Disappointed) - (Hater)
As you can see, the two items on both end of the scale are just shit stirrers who have no valid opinion but to stir shit, however I do believe there are at least some truth or valid points the devs should take into consideration.

 

calm down man, they are very professional, you might think that it's unprofessional not giving that much information, but if you look at blizzard you know that it's not true. All the games projects of blizzard don't even have it's original name released, i don't remember what it was called, but diablo 3 had a completely different name (on purpose) before they had a release date to inform their customers.

and yes, i think it's much better to see daily updates than see a big one per month. I know we're all dying of anxiety to the game to be released, complaining that they're not givin the information that you want is a personal opinion instead of a real issue.

completely agree, i see everyday some opinions that really makes sense, but sometimes they are put so wrongly that it don't have any chance to be taken into consideration by the devs, simply because people are agressive.

 

Oh i fully know i'm being over the top with that one. But it's cause i'm less than happy with how things have progressed.

Now as for me thinking they're not being professional because they're not effectively inviting us all into their dev chats and telling us everything... that's not the case. It's everything besides the satirical ending i put on my post that makes me say they're unprofessional. And all those things leading up require a bit more than usual for accurate damage control. You dig the hole deep and it takes more to fill it in is my point. I wouldn't be asking for what's left if they weren't so damn cryptic and vague about everything.

 

i see, yeah, i think that they could tell a little more, but about the satirical ending, it's one of the things i like most of their updates, you see, sometimes companies are so formal and stuff that it seems that they're from another world. They are talking with their customers, it means that giving the impression that they are closest to them\us is cool. what i don't like is updates that REALLY don't say anything, something that's not happening at all, all the time they say what needs to be worked on, which in my point of view is informative.

 

But that would mean the Beta is coming 2014? The beta is set for 2013, and the Full game 2014, so if it came only a Week before the Actual game, it would be somewhere in 2014, and not all betas need to be the best they can be! Minecrafts beta was bad, but it lasted for ever! It took so long for the actual release, that it lost its Beta name, and was just called Minecraft, not Minecrafts Beta.

I know that it could make people less excited for the full release, but No one is forcing them to watch gameplay videos, No one is forcing them to play it, if they Pre Orderd it then they should understand there getting it early, but if they dont want to loose their excitement, they dont have to! No one is forcing them to learn everything about the game and look on every single wiki to figure out even the smallest things, if they see a Starbound video, they dont have to watch it, they can just skip it, they can Ignore Starbound till the Full Release,

So excitement really cant hold off the Beta, As long as its Playable, Playable being with Minimal Crashing (Bugs are Ok since its a Beta!) and we can get 1-3 hours of just screwing around, (From the looks of things we can get 10 easily for JUST screwing around) then it can be a Beta, remember! Betas are suppose to be early and kinda bad, its not the Full game, were getting early access to the game to play/find bugs, were not paying X amount of money for a bad game, were paying X amount of money to play a EARLY BETA of the game, then getting the FULL game when it releases...

 

The best thing CF can do is to stop making new ways to let the community down and regroup.

Since Molly is the community manager, she needs to step-up and make this happen.

Bottom line, a bi-monthly or just monthly update with roadmap included would resolve most of the issues of 'transparency'.

 

And releasing an unfinished game doesn't seem unprofessional?

It's a fair point, but they're pretty much damned if they do, damned if they don't. I'd suggest that most indie devs are much less happy with releasing an unfinished game than for the release date to slip, and I can understand why.

The problem is that the expectation of publishers/public that devs set a release date is unrealistic. That it is considered unprofessional is because most people who aren't devs don't understand the process.

I'm pretty sure that they are leaving a bunch of stuff until post release. But again, this is a fair point, and I agree to a certain extent. There does seem to be a lot of content making it in that could be left for a bit.

But then, first impressions always count, and I can understand CF wanting their game to never be seen in a state where it could be seen as lacking. People can argue about this to death, but this is a dev decision, and it's a perfectly reasonable and valid one.

This is another case of damned if you do and damned if you don't. I've seen cases where devs have tried to explain something like this, and the results haven't been pretty. People always want another date given when you miss a date, and if the dev hedges at all, the lynching begins. And if they miss another... well, it's not pretty. Doesn't matter what explanation is given. Not to mention that most people simply don't understand the technical details about why things go wrong anyway...

When any communication with your fanbase takes time that you'd rather spend coding (I don't know any dev who prefers talking to people rather than coding) it's understandable when devs don't communicate. CF, for all that you berate them, is one of the better communicators. The problem is, that people always want more. People will never run out of questions that they want to ask the devs, and it seems that the more info a dev gives, the hungrier the fanbase becomes for more info. It's a really interesting phenomenon.

 

Where does this keep coming from?! You guys gotta stop spreading this stuff.


http://www.playstarbound.com/store/
http://www.playstarbound.com/roadmap/

Estimated release 2013. For both. Has been since preorders, has not changed. Stop stop stop stop stop trying to make it seem otherwise.

 

Releasing an unfinished game would be unprofessional. But we're talking about a beta primarily. Also, unfinished is a really finicky term for a game that will be receiving regular updates after release. The other point is first impressions have started already. Like it or not, a lot of people's idea of starbound will be taking into consideration all of this nonsense. And yes, people who have not heard of the game and won't until release won't be tainted by that, but that's a huge middle finger to those who preordered and made a lot of what they're doing now possible. Just saying.

 

oh, it's because they said on a stream (if my memory don't fail) that the full game is probably going to be released in early 2014, they didn't change because they're not sure about this.

 

I was just told that a bunch of times, they said the Road map is not updated yet, someones updating it in a few days, ill guess we will see who was right!

They also told me Tiy tweeted the Beta is coming 2013, but they have to little time for the Full release, so its coming 2014

Lol i thought both were coming 2013, then get yelled at by alot of guys, thats why i said that xD sorry if t is actually wrong!

 

Sigh. One of my earliest (probably last december or early this year) problems with CF has been that they release more info on streams, irc, or twitter than they do on this forum. I acknowledge that you said they aren't sure about it, but now that it's been said, everyone is holding it as gospel. That's still an extremely poor decision in my opinion. I mean... Wow. If i go into my thoughts on hearing this i'm going to go more over the top than i have on my joking post ending, so i'm just going to stop here.

 

But it seems that the beta is going to be very close to the full release (i mean by stuff inside the game). It's sad to see that people are loosing hope, in my opinion something made slowly but with quality is better than something made in a hurry and full of bugs.

Another thing that's good to be pointing out is that just because people hold it as a gospel desn't mean that the devs are the ones to blame. People like to think they know what's going on, so a simple supposition is held as truth. And even if this supposition is a fact, i wouldn't bother that much as long is i have the beta to play.

 

Same argument, really. CF have a checklist of features that are to be done for them to consider the game beta ready.

Sure, but the initial release is generally the one which forms impressions. Most reviews are done on the initial release version, and I've seen some scathing reviews of games which were released in a buggy state. Even when later updates fix those issues, the initial impression is often the lasting one - and very few reviewers do a second review after patching has been done.

I don't think it's quite like that for most people. I think even those people who are critical of CF about slipped dates etc are waiting for the game to be released before they pass final judgement. I doubt any of the noise on the forum at the moment will have any lasting effect if the game is a good one.

 

hahaha, it's funny seeing someone saying this. That happened recently to a AAA game. Look after "the worst game of 2013" you'll probably find a game named Ride To Hell. Just because of it's bugs they say that the game is "the worst of 2013" lol.

 

I'm not a spiteful person (contain your laughter). So i do truly mean this when i say i hope for the sake of the developers that this is true, and i do sincerely mean that. Poor decisions or not, it's a video game. I do hope this doesn't prevent them from making more games and being able to be paid while doing so. CF as a publisher on the other hand? Cannot say the same.

 

No, you've raised some good points, and we're debating this quite civilly, so I never thought you were.

They're clearly not a traditional publisher, in that being a dev studio themselves, they probably aren't going to strictly enforce release dates for any games they publish, but I'm having the same trouble understanding this that I had in the TAW pre-order thread - it seems that a lot of people want to punish TAW for having CF as a publisher. CF aren't going to be doing much with regards to TAW except promote it and provide a home for it, so I don't see the reason for bashing TAW for any perceived faults of CF, where those faults are with CF the developer, rather than CF the publisher.

 

Well, traditional publishers fund the devs to make the game, then get a portion of the funding they receive from the game. The situation with CF? I don't anticipate it's much different. They're likely going to be funding (at least in part) TAW, then getting some of the money they make from it. As such, people don't want ANY money going to CF. And i cannot say i blame them.

Edit: for clarification, though the problems are with CF the developer primarily, Publisher or developer they're the same people.

 

It's an interesting thought, and I admit I hadn't considered it, that CF might be providing some of their own pre-order funds to TAW to help with development. If they truly are doing that, I can see it upsetting people - that money was paid to CF to develop starbound, not allow it to act as a fund for other indie devs - though I'm possibly being hypocritical there, having argued in the "Interesting..." thread that it's none of our business what CF do with the money.

I had assumed that CF were merely providing a website and access to their fanbase, rather than a true, traditional publisher role. It would be an interesting question to know the answer to.

Sure, except that the devs of TAW are really the people being hurt by this. Or at least that's the case if CF haven't provided TAW any funds.

Edit: Just saw this post suggesting that Robit Studios don't get funding from CF.