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Feedback [Nightly] The story line saps some fun from it all

Discussion in 'Starbound Discussion' started by Aliencommander, Jul 3, 2016.

  1. SivCorp

    SivCorp Parsec Taste Tester

    You all know there is this section... called "mods" right?

    It lest you skip the cutscenes, change the starting point, change the story even if you wish.


    The game is very pliable to your tastes, so why are you here complaining about it?
     
  2. Xylia

    Xylia Tiy's Beard

    Oh, but...

    "WE SHOULDN"T HAVE TO USE MODS TO FIX THE GAME!!!!!!!1111oneoneone"

    *sigh*

    I know I'm getting rather sick of that flimsy argument myself.
     
    Omegagreen likes this.
  3. Jonesy

    Jonesy Sarif's Attack Kangaroo Forum Moderator

    Keep it civil, please.
     
  4. Master Automan IV

    Master Automan IV Phantasmal Quasar

    Whats the point of a game if it can't stand on its own without mods? Thats gaming 101.
     
    Pingeh likes this.
  5. Omegagreen

    Omegagreen Starship Captain

    I'm pretty sure I've said this before, but I like the story apart from:
    • Being forced to fight the erchius horror every time I make a new character.
    • Somehow defeating a creature Florans have been trained to hunt from birth.
    • Asra's whole "We will make the galaxy hate stuff. We are EEEEEEEEEEVIIIIIIIL!" (her cult could probably stay as it's very likely for something like that to arise)
    • Killing Big Ape.
    • The concept of the Bone Dragon.
    • The Ruin.
    • The Cultivator.
    • Tonuac.
    • Nuru and the concept of her having a "father"
    • The big gate that got in the way of my Fluffalo farm.
    • The Protectorate in its entirety.
    • The whole "Ragtag mini-protectorate with one from each race"
    After this: Esther pretty much become phased out and The Baron and whatshisname the Hylotl would be never encountered.

    But yes, I would like to be able to play Starbound without ever finding the big ominous gate without mods.
    Mods would be better off being gameplay enhancers rather than a tool to fix mistakes made by the Dev Team. When a lot of people download or ask others for "fixit mods" as I call them, it's usually a sign to say that the Dev Team have an error that requires fixing badly. I don't know how many requests I've heard for race variation or complete and seamless story skipping, but I can tell you, I've heard them from at least over 10 people each. If one person can hear this in one small corner of the forum, then there is a more than fair chance it is an issue faced by many others.
     
    Pingeh and Master Automan IV like this.
  6. Master Automan IV

    Master Automan IV Phantasmal Quasar

    So thats basically 90% of the story?
     
  7. Omegagreen

    Omegagreen Starship Captain

    Yes.
     
    Master Automan IV likes this.
  8. Xylia

    Xylia Tiy's Beard

    Some games are meant to be modders' sandboxes from the start? *shrug*

    Nothing wrong with that. SB has awesome mods that make the game truly great.

    What's the point of a game that can't stand on its own without mods (I am in no way agreeing that SB is like that; I'm merely theoretically answering the question)? The point is, it's a sandbox to allow creative people to make awesome content for, almost like a game engine that is insanely easy to create content for.
     
  9. lazarus78

    lazarus78 The Waste of Time

    And if they had infinite time and resources, Im sure they would have loved to give alternate opening sequences for every race like they originally intended, but that is a crap ton of work.

    There is a reason games opt for singular starting sequences. They are easier to manage and get the job done. Its not bad design, it is efficient design.

    That is personal opinion. I think the game stands just fine on it's own despite having done thousands of hours of modding. Clearly you don't. People like to point to mods as being "fixing the problems the lazy develoors didnt want to" or "developers make modders fix/finish their games", which is just short sighted. Chucklefish made the game they wanted. They just left it open for modders to mess with. If you don't like a decision the developers made, you are almost always able to change it.

    This kind of mentality appears with basically every modable game. Some people think the game is poorly made and the developers are lazy, and modders are left to "fix" it. That may be true for a few games, but certinly not the vast majority, like Starbound, or any Bethesda game, etc.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2016
  10. Master Automan IV

    Master Automan IV Phantasmal Quasar

    I don't think you understand what I mean.
    There's a clear difference between games like, Skyrim, Fallout 3, Minecraft, Gmod etc, that have a large modding community because the games were fun and "good", and a game that relies solely on mods for it to be even near enjoyable.
    I'm not saying that Starbounds base game is barebones, I'm just speaking generally.

    Games like Gmod and Minecraft don't count because it's not dependent on the community. Its about excuses like, @SivCorp's, that imply that mods should excuse game flaws.
    It has nothing to do with mods in general.

    For example, a game has terrible, cluttered, janky, confusing, and non user friendly UI, and then some Randy spouts, "get the mod, your criticism is wrong." You don't criticize a game based on its mods, you criticize it based on the base game.

    "The point is, it's a sandbox to allow creative people to make awesome content for, almost like a game engine that is insanely easy to create content for."
    Not even close. Starbound can barely be considered a "sandbox", its more like Terraria in its genre placement.
    Starbound doesn't even have a strong modding community anyways. Minecraft despite having mods, the base game is playable and content worthy.
    The thing is, the intro is not that good.
    Making a simple cutscene for each specific race isn't hard. They did it before but in a smaller scale, so I don't know whats the problem. I'm not asking for a deep individual backstory, but guess what? The devs did it anyways and look how that turned out.

    I'm not asking for alt.intros anyways, I'm telling you how much of a flaud argument it is to imagine an alt.intro and to make myself engaged in the story rather than it just happening.
    I never gave my opinion on starbound.
    "Clearly you don't". Yeah sure, bud.

    That's a strawman fallacy.
    No one has called all mods "fixes".

    You don't reveiw a game based on its mods. You review it based on its base game. Just because a mod "fixes" a problem doesn't make any criticism invalid. Just because you can change it by downloading a mod doesn't make the flaw go away. That's a weak and an aplogictic excuse.
     
    Littleman9Mew2 likes this.
  11. SivCorp

    SivCorp Parsec Taste Tester

    Starbound was designed TO be modded... and being a sandbox, you should be able to bring in your own sand to play in it, without people claiming it doesn't count.

    There are MANY flaws in this game, but the devs at least saw the wisdom in making so much of it moddable, so as to help alleviate those problems.

    But this topic is about the story, and on that point, I stand by my original comment... it is a 15$ game with a 15$ story. simple as that.
     
  12. Xylia

    Xylia Tiy's Beard

    While I have nothing against SB's story, even though it is a bit tropish, I have seen <$15 games have amazing story.

    Undertale, anyone?

    BUT...

    As amazing as Undertale's story is, I've played ~10 hours of Undertale and ~500 hours of Starbound and 1000+ hours of Terraria (which has zilch for story whatsoever).

    The story, just like graphics, isn't the be-all and end-all of a game. Undertale is reasonably fun, but it is lacking replayability.
     
    Master Automan IV likes this.
  13. Master Automan IV

    Master Automan IV Phantasmal Quasar

    You can't possibly be serious.
    When I say, "mods Shouldn't fix a games flaws" I don't mean, "a game shouldn't have mods".
    It's so painfully obvious. When you review a game, for the last time, you cannot pretend as if mods are an excuse for flaws.
    It's a like film not explaining important details for the overall story to make sense, then being told to go read the book.
    This...
     
    Pingeh and Littleman9Mew2 like this.
  14. Xylia

    Xylia Tiy's Beard

    WoW does that.

    They leave out important plot points between expansions and then go "ITS IN THE BOOK!"

    Always hated when they used to do that, but meh. I don't play WoW anymore, so...
     
    Master Automan IV likes this.
  15. Omegagreen

    Omegagreen Starship Captain

    A bit more on topic, I am incredibly disappointed that nowhere can I find a mod that removes the story elements from the main game. Wouldn't be so bad if the dev team could write... or hire a writer. It's not so much tropish (tropes are everywhere, trying to avoid them just makes more) it's more cliched (tropish and cliched are important)
    They don't even follow their own character's biology. For this, I mean that Nuru stated that she learned from her father. Aren't Florans born in coccoons and the whole tribe is semi-familial?
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2016
  16. lazarus78

    lazarus78 The Waste of Time

    Because you cant just "remove it" and expect everything to work. That is a lot of work to try and do, and honestly, no one wants to do it, as seen by the lack of such a mod.

    As for Nuru. Who says they are talking about biological father? Could just be a father figure.
     
    Master Automan IV likes this.
  17. Master Automan IV

    Master Automan IV Phantasmal Quasar

    Or just seems unrealistic to change the entire plot of the game with just a simple mod.

    Who knows it might happen?

    On the topic of Nuru, let's not delve into the world that's called "floran- biology".
    Plus the old lore didn't follow its own rules anyways. Still doesn't excuse the new plots flaws, but you get my point.
     
  18. Omegagreen

    Omegagreen Starship Captain

    So they've said this game would be mod friendly, but the story is incredibly cumbersome to mod.
    Not sure if this is true, but perhaps the story is what's cutting down the framerate at the moment.
    As for lore, the lore for florans and glitch seem to be more focused around giving them reasons act more like humans rather than building on them as a race at the moment.
    Yeah, I think we're stuck with this story and lore, if this is left the way it is, I think I may have to give up on the game.
     
  19. lazarus78

    lazarus78 The Waste of Time

    The game is very modder friendly. The most modder friendly game I have ever seen. That doesn't mean it is easy to rip out a huge chunk of the game.
     
  20. RedPanda_Warrior

    RedPanda_Warrior Star Wrangler

    Sorry to be a little off topic, but doesn't Sombra from Overwatch look strikingly like Asra Nox? Take a close look at the two.
     

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