Girls looking more like girls

This is basically the key to this whole discussion.

 

How do you get that double "S"?

 

I cannot believe you quoted his entire post for that

 

*cracks knuckles* Let's do this.

It's not just your exasperation here, Shifter. Your attempts to make someone else's arguments seem trite and overblown by suggesting that the argument is tired or faulting it because BIOLOGY, when the real issue is not about biology but rather about being able to make characters that they can relate to is crap. It's indefensible. You are attempting to strike down someone else's viewpoints, somebody's attempt at making the game a little more welcoming to others because you are not comfortable with that choice. Society has seen to it that your comfort is prioritized in damn near every other single situation. [appropriate religious point of reference]-forbid that we look for options that make people other than you comfortable.

That is why your arguments are rude. Because you are debasing or ignoring any other variant of person other than the ones you want to agree are 'normal'. Because you refuse to accept that being inviting towards other people is worth whatever non-issues might occur as a result of those actions. We call that bigotry, Shifter, and it has no place here.

Suggesting that we not do a thing because it might cause an uproar is ridiculous, especially when that course of action is intended to help other people. What kind of folks do you see having an issue with an third option/genderless system that literally causes them no harm? No, really, take a minute or two to think about the kind of people who would prioritize that over more important issues. What kind of person focuses on things meant to be inclusive towards others and makes that out to be a problem? I can point out a few examples. Don't be those people, Shifter, and don't cater to their whims.

There is a quote by Edmund Burke that I rather like. It's quite good. It goes like this:
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.

Small evils as well as large, Shifter. Small hurts and pains towards others as well as the big ones. When you do nothing because you are concerned that people who hate others, who are intolerant, who have prejudices and biases that force others below them, then you are supporting those goals. Don't be that guy.

There's no reason why male should be the base*, and as noted earlier, a body-type toggle would be the best way to go about handling that. There are already armor variations, and they are already likely tied to body-shape. This is not a hard thing to implement.

* This is another important thing to look at. Why do you feel like male would be the baseline? Why not female? Why is male the base and female the variant? Why not the other way around? Seriously, give it some thought.

Don't play the victim here, Shifter. You have literally nothing to lose. Not a single thing. You are arguing against something that has a larger impact for other communities and you don't have even a single chip on the table. You have zero investment because you lose nothing. What, then, is the basis of your argument? Why so vehement against the ability of others to relate to their characters in game?

Please feel free to educate yourself, because you are again incorrect. The definition of trans is so above and beyond what you currently understand it to be.

Have you ever had someone sit down and say "Shifter, I know you were really interested in being part of this, but you're a minority. I'm sorry, we just don't have the time for you. Better luck next time!"? What about constantly? What if that was the sort of response you got every day for the majority of your life? Have you had that happen? What if every game you ever played showed only people who were different than you, every single one denied you the opportunity to relate to the character you played the way other people had the opportunity to? Imagine that was your life. Now imagine that it takes approximately 30 minutes to redesign a gui, change a few code options, and then a coupla hours to test to make sure everything is working okay. Because that's what this is. That's how long it takes. The values already exist. The references are already there. Are you suggesting that those few hours are so precious that they can't be spent including an option so that, we as a community and Chucklefish as a company, can say "No, you know what? You get that opportunity this time"? Because if you are then I think you need to re-evaluate your priorities.

The things you have said, the ways that you've said them, are based in some old and rather outdated models of social behavior. You're defending them like they're gosepl when you should be re-examining the modes of thought you hold and why people might be put off by them or why, in fact, some people might be hurt by them. If you want to roll with this whole "I am a man of science!" schtick, you might as well go full-bore with it.

Why is keeping gender stereotypes REASONABLE, when the other option is acceptance of others? We've already disproved the time argument, this isn't a slippery slope so you can toss that argument out the window as well. What, really, is your motivation for this?

Side note: Exasperation as a concept is not offensive. The means with which you display it can be. Being condescending towards others is pretty offensive, and that's how you've been approaching this thing. Cut it out.

 

Please don't get into a huge ideological discussion about gender here. It's not the time or place.

Personally, I don't think the girls in Starbound need to look more "like girls". Their body types look plenty feminine to me.
I do agree that we should allow either gender to choose whatever hairstyle they like, so I'll bring that up with the other devs.

And our female armor is roughly the same as our male armor! Just sized to fit boobs.

 

In this day and age there are people who don't identify as male or female.
Are there really people who are against this? What is there to gain from denying this option? It's not exactly a game changer.

 

I identify as an aqua-blue flying walrus, doesn't mean I'll be able to choose this in Starbound.

 

Yep, because one concept is easy and reachable and the other is an aqua-blue flying walrus. Poor argument.

 

Finally, some sense was made! Thank the Heavens and praised be the admins.

 

Please don't lump my opinion in with those who said genderless people don't exist.

^ Exactly.
Locking this thread, I can see it's only going to get uglier from here on out. It was a pretty simple suggestion thread and I see no reason why it had to turn into a huge debate about gender identity.