1x zoom

Discussion in 'Mechanics' started by ZFunklord, Jan 22, 2017.

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  1. ZFunklord

    ZFunklord Void-Bound Voyager

    I can set 1x zoom in the config file which looks great on my monitor which has very large square pixels anyway.
    Why not allow people to set it in the menu?

    And while you're at it, let people zoom in on the fly, by making UI for it and mappable buttons?
     
  2. Iris Blanche

    Iris Blanche Pudding Paradox Forum Moderator

    Moved to suggestions section.

    Regards
    Iris Blanche
     
  3. JOHNKRELL007

    JOHNKRELL007 Scruffy Nerf-Herder

    The zoom levels are unlocked by a few mods, including madtulips mod, I believe it's locked by default so that players with low-end PCs don't complain about performance on 1x zoom.
     
    Never likes this.
  4. ZFunklord

    ZFunklord Void-Bound Voyager

    With that argument all performance settings and blending/lighting effects should be removed. ;)
     
    xaliber likes this.
  5. JOHNKRELL007

    JOHNKRELL007 Scruffy Nerf-Herder

    Well zoom is more tempting and more confusing to players who don't know that it would cause a lot more lag. Graphics settings are more noticeable and more players would realize that that's the cause of their lag and turn it down.
     
  6. lazarus78

    lazarus78 The Waste of Time

    1x zoom would have a much greater impact on performance than any of those other settings. It is about managing performance, not eliminating the risk of bad performance. The fact that we can even alter the zoom levels is great. Most games would just lock them to their defaults.
     
  7. ZFunklord

    ZFunklord Void-Bound Voyager

    Are you for real?
    That's the kind of reasoning that leads to the dumbing down of user interfaces and makes software suck.
    It's a graphics option, like any other, common in many 2D games, and it's there to be used if you want it. You can't eliminate stupid no matter what you do.
    Most games get jerky when you zoom out too much, so it's nothing new. And it happens to work better on my set-up.
    If I accidentally enter the config screen it changes to 2x, and I need to exit the game, open a text editor to edit it and restart the game.

    In any case there should be a high frameskip detector that reverts to lowest possible setting so people don't get stuck in an unresponsive UI when something goes wrong.
    It also gives devs an immediate kick in the butt if they accidentally create game action situations that require 100x more performance than normal.
     
  8. lazarus78

    lazarus78 The Waste of Time

    But you can help prevent stupid. The setting is still there to be changed if you wish, but just not from the default settings menu. Keep things out of reach of the children, and the world is a better place.

    Yes, but understand what these zoom levels mean. 4x means effectively every pixel is blown up to 4 times their size, 3x is 3 times, 2x is 2 times. What this means is that 2x zoom is 4 TIMES more demanding than 4x, and 1x would 4TIMES more demanding than 2x. So we are talking whole factors of performance demand increase, not just a slight increase from scrolling out a little bit and having some more things on screen, the game and computer now have to render 4 times the frames, on top of all the other calculations it needs to do for AI, physics, lighting, etc, all now 4x work load.
     
    Derpyman890 likes this.
  9. ZFunklord

    ZFunklord Void-Bound Voyager

    I really hope you are not one of the devs with this kind of condescending attitude, when I've already explained why it wasn't working out for people with low resolution displays, and why the workaround doesn't work.

    Children have better eyesight, but I sincerely doubt there are many with 8k monitors, switching to 1x, and complaining about it.

    So what? For alpha blending you are adding 3 muls per layer to each pixel blit. That is the heaviest part of most of these new 2D games.

    Anyhow it's irrelevant, if you really wanted to protect people from themselves there are more effective ways to do that. I already gave one, and there are plenty of others, such as cropping the screen when framedrops go high etc.
    Any one of them is better than forcing people to play at VGA resolution.

    Basically, whenever you make assumptions about what hardware your game is going to be running on. Don't. You're almost certainly wrong.
     
  10. lazarus78

    lazarus78 The Waste of Time

    All games assume hardware. They have to. They need something to base optimal performance on, and the fact is, most computers can't do Starbound at 1x very well. Im not talking about 8k monitors, Im talking simple 1080. Over 35,000 blocks need to be processed and rendered at, hopefully, 60 frames a second, along with the lighting and physics, and any monster AI. You are failing to factor in everything the game is doing. You are thinking it is some simplistic 2D game, but it is not as simple as you would think.

    You can get 1x zoom if you wish, that function is there, but it would be foolish to add it to the settings menu.
     
  11. ZFunklord

    ZFunklord Void-Bound Voyager

    Again with the condescending attitude. Why do you assume I don't know more than you about game design?
    My 5 year old laptop does 1x fine on an external 1080p display while running on 20h batteries. So you are obviously wrong.
    However, that's not when I need it, I need it on the built-in display which has a much lower resolution.
    The problem is that it keeps reverting back to 2x which effectively gives me VGA resolution on a game with 2015 (enormous) sized sprites.
    With 2x I can barely see enemies before they hit me.

    It would be foolish not to allow people to take advantage of the screen real-estate they have by purposely sabotaging the resolution of the game.
     
  12. ZFunklord

    ZFunklord Void-Bound Voyager

    I solved it with a mod now, but it shouldn't have been necessary for such a fundamental option.
     
  13. lazarus78

    lazarus78 The Waste of Time

    Because you haven't demonstrated that you do know more.

    Unverifiable anecdotal evidence.

    Not sure what you are talking about. It would only "reset" if you change the zoom in game, which obvisouly would mean you can't get back to 1x while still in game. Otherwise you have other options.
    - Edit the config and make it read only.
    - Get one of the mods that actually adds the setting to the menu.

    You can take full advantage of the screen realestate. Zoom level doesn't hinder that. Zoom level =/= resolution. Each will effect performance different.

    1x at 192x1080 - http://i.imgur.com/0HsEQUT.png
    1x at ~1350x780 - http://i.imgur.com/tU8w09Y.png

    Same scale, different resolution.
     
  14. ZFunklord

    ZFunklord Void-Bound Voyager

    There's something seriously wrong with you.
    Nobody seems to like you, and you never say anything useful.
     
  15. lazarus78

    lazarus78 The Waste of Time

    The "Genetically Modified" badge comes from being helpful in the modding section, so that alone would prove that to be incorrect.

    I am very vocal, yes, and I'm sure there are some that don't particularly like me, which is fine. I'm not out to please anyone, nor will someone not liking me cause me to change.

    Now, with your ad hominem out of the way, I will call it quits here.
     
  16. Jonesy

    Jonesy Sarif's Attack Kangaroo Forum Moderator

    Guys, take it easy. Both of you.

    If someone's being rude or has otherwise broken the rules, report it. Taking matters into your own hands will only get you into trouble as well. Happens far more often than I like to see.

    A very cavalier attitude you have there. I would have thought you've been here long enough to have read the rules at some point, and note that they ask that users be respectful towards one another. Even if people not liking you apparently won't cause you to change, I would hope that the forum rules would be a little more influential. Especially when you've got a number of past warning that you may not have properly learned from.
     
  17. ZFunklord

    ZFunklord Void-Bound Voyager

    The rules also say not to spam and write annoying posts without content.
    I bet mods let him get away with it by blaming it on some diagnose or something.
    No matter, I ignored him yesterday already when I saw what he had written to others.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2017
  18. Iris Blanche

    Iris Blanche Pudding Paradox Forum Moderator

    Going to close this one. You found a workaround/solution for your problem and the discussion went off-topic anyways.

    Regards
    Iris Blanche
     
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