Just wanted to drop in and voice some thoughts

yes take one part of a sentence out of context, awesone job.

 

The context dosent make that argument (that your entitled forum access becuse you bought the game) less flawed.

 

why are you trolling me? DOes this help the forum popularity?

 

Why not? Buying the game on steam lets you post in that forum and gives you the mouse, which indicateds to other players that you actually own the game.

This forum doesn't have this thing, so as far as I am concerned every poster in here is just a dev alt account shilling the game. No way to know if they own the game.

Aren't they?

 

Silly me, here i tought pointing out flaws in arguments were one of the basis in a argument.

I didnt intend to provoke a emotional responce. Food for thought however: If you arent willing to defend your own arguments then perhaps you shouldent make them in the first place?

 

Cherry picking points to reply to will always elicit this kind of response. You should have been ready for that reaction.

 

@Garatgh Deloi
What you did was taking the argument (buying on steam grants forum access on steam), stripping it of its context (buying grants forum access) and then building an arbitrary (if not hostile) response criticizing the correctness of the stripped argument (you're silly because that's wrong). As @Starbug pointed out correctly: Steam does in fact require you to own a game to post in its forum. So there's your food for thought.

I have to agree with @QuadX. Although I have never been the victim of deletion/banning/closing directly myself, I do have experience with moderators trying to enforce their own (supposedly the only correct and non-offensive) believes all for the sake of "keeping it civil", not knowing that they are moderators to enforce forum rules, not to experience grandiose delusions on the Internet. Nobody wants censorship, least the developers looking for representative feedback.

 

The poster does. I won't warn/ban you if I think you're being condescending. I'll warn/ban you if you are being condescending. And if you still think you're in the right, it's why I maintain an open door policy about my moderation -- you can add and chat with me whenever. Unfortunately with Steam -- due to lack of moderation and structure; snide, condescending, and being sarcastic or joking at another person's expense has become the common norm of posting. But it's not acceptable. You can disagree with that. But that's what it is.

Also -- I think there's a misinterpretation here. When I say "The poster wasn't calm enough to present their concerns appropriately" I am of course referring to the (unfortunately) many instances of "The devs are a bunch of ****tards, where the **** are the keybinds. **** you ***holes!". Is the desire for keybinds valid? Yes. Was the manner of expressing that desire valid? No. I'm sure you, yourself, could write up a dozen different ways to inquire about keybinds without resorting to violating rules.

It doesn't matter if you think the rule is "bogus" or even "fair". The rules are rules, and they are different in most places. And there are consequences for not adhering to the rules. Nothing biased or difficult about it. Break a rule, earn the consequence. As far as I am concerned -- that's how it works; whether you think Starbound is the greatest game in all the verse, or you hope to see Tiy die in a fire.

Raise your eyebrows all you want. If you don't understand the context, message me if you are truly concerned. But your inability (and it's not yours alone) to see the error in the posts, is one of the main issues with Steam. Lots of good people, lots of good feedback and criticisms; but absolutely poor posting etiquette -- often belittling, mocking, shaming, or condescending. Not to mention there's a HUGE issue with arguing -- and usually over NOTHING. Throw derailment into the mix -- and sorry to say -- there's going to be a lot of bans until people recognize the rules and behave more accordingly. It's doubly difficult because each warning and each ban perpetuates a paranoia -- the ban has to have a subtext, an ulterior motive, or a heavy bias. As demonstrated by this tangent conversation.

I'm not Chucklefish, it's not my game. For clarification -- Moderators are NOT Chucklefish. We're volunteers from the community who volunteer our time to help enforce the rules -- so anyone in the community can benefit from not having to be subject to inappropriate material or an attack on their character, opinions, or intelligence.

Again, I'm not CF.
Again, this is also a huge issue with many posters within the Steam Community.
You think you are entitled to speak your opinion, condescending or no, because you basically bought into the forum use. But that's a half truth. You bought into forum use, entitled to speak your opinion, so long as it follows the rules and guidelines set by that forum. We don't have any rules dictating what your opinions need be, so your opinions can be whatever, just so long as they follow the rules -- which again -- it doesn't matter if you find those rules to be "bogus", they are the rules that are to be followed. Enforcement of those rules is up to Chucklefish AND Moderation as they see fit -- an allowance granted to Chucklefish by Steam. If you are unhappy with the way in which moderation may be "too harsh" or "too lenient", or even if you feel there is a "bias" -- your concerns must be brought to the attention of Molly, as she oversees all of the activity of the moderators she has chosen.

 

Not only do I not take any Steam Forum seriously but I avoid them as much as possible to avoid getting involved in useless discussion. I was given to understand that they were most concerned about children using the forum. Some of the communication methods young people find there are at least as scary as hateful labels. There is so much negative behaviour going on through public forums that one can not really talk about Steam alone but better methods for dealing with conflict have to start somewhere.

 

well tecnicly, anyone can post on the steam forums, if they have the game or not

tho i find it strange how people think chucklefish dont have the right to moderate there steam forum
its there fourm they can do whatever the hell they want
if your rude they will ban you, its not hard to understand

(btw: starbug that last part wasnt pointed at you im blaming post merging lol)

 

I didnt say that he was silly i said hes argument was silly, theres a difference. But after rereading my post im forced to concede your point. Its pains me to admit as much, but the post in question (mine) was rather rude and childish.

@QuadX i apologize for my error.

However (this part is directed to no7H again, not QuadX) saying that steam gives you access too the forums if you buy the games is false. You can access all their game forums at any time regardless if you own the product or not. Its not connected in anyway.

 

As a moderator you are in fact a representative of Chucklefish, as a moderator on steam for Starbound you are the face of Chucklefish, again being their sole representative. You are representing the devs and you are using semantics and technicalities by stating you aren't and that it isn't your game. Technically you are correct, however everything you do and say in this forum and in the Steam forum does directly reflect Chucklefish and Starbound devs. In my opinion, if you are not involved with the development of the game, you probably shouldn't be a moderator, especially if you're going to give yourself the out of "I'm not Chucklefish and it's not my game." and schluff yourself of the responsibility that CHucklefish has to it's customers. When I say things like "Chucklefish" and "your game" it's to point out that you are in fact representing them (as a lawyer would). Since you are just a "lowly moderator" perhaps you can link me to and actual employee or developer from Chucklefish since you obviously have no interest in customer service and simply don't care because as you have stated are not Chuckelfish and it isn't your game.

 

That is correct, if under access you understand read-only access. There are forums that require you to own the game to post anything (e.g. 7 days to die). I can't check if that's the case for starbound as I already own it so I was assuming it is based on QuadX's and Starbug's posts.

@QuadX
Good point. I guess moderators who participate in discussions or make moderation decisions themselves (e.g. without mollys explicit OK) inherently become a representation of chucklefish, intentionally or not. You can't have power without responsibility.

But it is still you who makes that decision. Bias included. If natural language would be that binary, all moderation would be done by an algorithm.

That is a great gesture, it is however irrelevant if someone wants to discuss "your bias", as it is you who is to judge it (and the judgement of one's own bias is biased).

 

Dat is a gud and quite interesting point.

 

I can not convince either of you of a lack of "bias", nor can I argue that I do represent CF slightly if only in appearances and reputation -- as Molly saw fit to add me to the moderation team for her trust in my judgement. A consideration of my character that I'm sure she made again when she added me to Steam moderation. I have corrected you otherwise in assumptions about moderation and why things are what they are. If you think things are biased, I already told you that it is Molly you have to contact. If you think the rules are unfairly enforced (either overly enforced or lax), again, you must bring the attention to Molly. But if you feel the rules themselves are the problem -- you must take that up with Steam. Until then. They will be enforced.

 

shoulda ended that post with this

 

More like

 

And that is exactly the kind of stuff that is so very confusing. The post cleary breaks forum rules (Spam/off-topic posts). The only action I see being taken is a like by a mod.

 

You guys seem really committed to this grievance. I wasn't planning on coming back to say anything of substance, but I have to say, Starbound Forum Radicals [SFR! SFR! We Shall Overcome!,] your devotion to freedom of indie game support forums speech and has me admiring your tenacity, if not your sense of perspective. I mean, its not the hill I would choose to die on, but it takes all types to burn a world.

 

@DukeOfRiven
Please refrain from judgements over the motivation of those discussing the topic as it adds nothing to it. Your provocation - even if hidden under a layer of intellectuality in its formulation - is not helping anyone (not to mention that rule#1 feels offended).
If you disagree (and you want that disagreement respected), please do so by logical means (hell, I love logical means!), not confrontational ones. The goal is for everyone's situation to improve. That includes yours, mine, the moderators', starbound's and chucklefish's. If you're not interested in improvement or can't perceive an opportunity for it, feel free to opt out and devote your time to more satisfying matters.